This is a thread about COVID opinions, discussions, alerts, gripes, information, holding forths, disagreements, challenges, differing points of view on what's really what.
There also another COVID thread.
It is for the COVID sitrep where you are in your part of the world, for what you're seeing there, what you're experiencing, how you & yours are doing, offering support to & being supported by this community of ufozs-ers. (https://ufozs.com/smf/index.php?topic=40.0)
I was going to put this int he "situation where you are" thread but I guess it's better here!
So on Monday, July 19, England* will have "Freedom Day"** when the majority of COVID restrictions on life will be lifted. No more mask mandates, employees encouraged to return to work, bars and clubs re-opening, and so on.
But at the same time we're in the middle of a new wave of infections. While the most vulnerable 2/3rds of the UK population are double-vaccinated, the most sociable 1/3rd aren't. Cases and hospitalisations are rising quickly, deaths less so.
I guess epidemiologists in the rest of the world will be settling into their most comfortable chairs and ordering popcorn.
It's going to be interesting.
* Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have their own rules set by devolved legislatures. It's complicated.
** So named by politicians. Public opinion remains 60/40 in favour of continuing with masks and social distancing. Personally I quite like having my air filtered (I get hayfever and it's peak season) and not having to get too close to other human beings.
Quote from: sheddi on July 14, 2021, 04:17:29 PM
I was going to put this int he "situation where you are" thread but I guess it's better here!
So on Monday, July 19, England* will have "Freedom Day"** when the majority of COVID restrictions on life will be lifted. No more mask mandates, employees encouraged to return to work, bars and clubs re-opening, and so on.
But at the same time we're in the middle of a new wave of infections. While the most vulnerable 2/3rds of the UK population are double-vaccinated, the most sociable 1/3rd aren't.
(https://img.ifunny.co/images/cddf4847346747a2764187a98b47591573ffd965d51cd32bc162e25c6c60c770_1.jpg)
QuoteCases and hospitalisations are rising quickly, deaths less so.
I guess epidemiologists in the rest of the world will be settling into their most comfortable chairs and ordering popcorn.
It's going to be interesting.
Yep. Same over here.
Tuesday marks the first time a [US] state has been placed under a travel advisory since June 1 (http://upi.com/Top_News/US/2021/07/13/Chicago-travel-advisory-Missouri-Arkansas-COVID-19/7181626214247/)
Chicago Health Commissioner: "The COVID-19 pandemic is not over." Health officials in Chicago issued a travel warning for the states of Missouri and Arkansas on Tuesday amid rising COVID-19 cases.Although there are only two states on the list, officials noted that other states could be added if cases continue to rise, including Nevada, Louisiana, Utah and Florida. (http://msn.com/en-us/travel/news/chicago-reinstates-covid-19-travel-advisory-for-two-states/ar-AAM9YG8?ocid=BingNewsSearch)
QuotePublic opinion remains 60/40 in favour of continuing with masks and social distancing. Personally I quite like having my air filtered (I get hayfever and it's peak season) and not having to get too close to other human beings.
Personally I do too.
Preprint study from Baylor College of Medicine (http://medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.06.28.21258780v1.full#T1)
- April, US
- large, open-air tent wedding
- 92 person fully vaccinated required attendees
- six guests over 50 contracted symptomatic COVID-19
- Two had gotten the vaccine from Pfizer, two had gotten the vaccine from Moderna, and two had gotten the vaccine called Covaxin
- Their infections were confirmed with lab tests and viral sequencing for the Delta variant
- One Covaxin recipient and one patient who had Pfizer in their 60s came down with more severe infections.
- The Pfizer patient was a man with no known medical conditions that increase the odds of contracting COVID-19.
- The Covaxin patient, also with no COVID-19 comorbidities, died
- All of the other patients who contracted symptomatic COVID-19 did have preconditions, including hypertension, overweight, and diabetes
- Suggesting the possibility Delta variant may pose the highest risk out of any currently circulating SARS-CoV-2 variants, with increased transmissibility over Alpha variant and possible vaccine breakthrough.
cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/health-departments/breakthrough-cases.html (http://cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/health-departments/breakthrough-cases.html)
As of July 12, 2021, more than 159 million people in the United States had been fully vaccinated against COVID-19.
During the same time, CDC received reports from 48 U.S. states and territories of 5,492 patients tested positive COVID-19 vaccine breakthrough infection who were hospitalized or died.
28% of the breakthrough cases that were hospitalized were asymptomatic or not hospitalized because of COVID. 26% of breakthrough cases who died were asymptomatic or did not die from COVID itself. 75% of breakthrough cases were age 65 or older.
CDC is coordinating with state and local health departments to investigate SARS-CoV-2 infections among people who received COVID-19 vaccine and identify patterns or trends.
cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/downloads/COVID-vaccine-breakthrough-case-investigations-Protocol.pdf (http://cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/downloads/COVID-vaccine-breakthrough-case-investigations-Protocol.pdf)
So yesterday the Secretary of State for Health tested positive for COVID. He's double-vaccinated.
Today the Prime Minister and Chanceller of the Exchequer both get identified as contacts (no surprise there) and directed to self-isolate (there's some farce around that (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57879730) but it's politics and not relevant to this post). Both are double-vaccinated and PM has already survived COVID once.
But tomorrow is *still* being promoted as "Freedom Day" when England (not Scotland, Wales or NI) relaxes most of the remaining COVID restrictions. Social distancing and mask-wearing will be encouraged but not legally enforcable.
I'm ordering more FFP2 masks (N95s) ...
I am seeing more and more evidence that the population I live among does not understand the indoor aerosol suspension factor spread of covid. Or, for that matter, even know what aerosols are outside of something that's being sprayed by a can.
Or that a mask, were one to choose to wear one, needs to cover their mouth AND nose or wearing it is useless except to catch the heavy spit particles expelled when talking.
Many here just pull them over their mouths and breathe through their noses. Neither mitigating intake of others breath, nor preventing their breath being expelled to protect their fellow man.
Besides, many here think COVID is over for them now that they are fully vaccinated. There are at least a couple here I've heard say they haven't heard we're in another wave because of Delta. Or what the Delta variant is.
For someone with a compromised immune system this is crazy making.
Quote from: sheddi on July 18, 2021, 06:16:02 AM
I'm ordering more FFP2 masks (N95s) ...
Yep. Just put in an order for N95s myself. (without the respirator valve)
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on August 12, 2021, 01:32:16 AM
I am seeing more and more evidence that the population I live among does not understand the indoor aerosol suspension factor spread of covid. Or, for that matter, even know what aerosols are outside of something that's being sprayed by a can.
Or that a mask, were one to choose to wear one, needs to cover their mouth AND nose or wearing it is useless except to catch the heavy spit particles expelled when talking.
Many here just pull them over their mouths and breathe through their noses. Neither mitigating intake of others breath, nor preventing their breath being expelled to protect their fellow man.
Besides, many here think COVID is over for them now that they are fully vaccinated. There are at least a couple here I've heard say they haven't heard we're in another wave because of Delta. Or what the Delta variant is.
For someone with a compromised immune system this is crazy making.
Well, to be fair to them, the media system our society relies on for continuing education throughout adulthood mixed up the pandemic crisis education with a hybrid course on creative writing and low grade reality tv shows.
This is sort of like walking into gym class to find you're taking a pop quiz on advanced physics. We're the nerds from the math club smirking at everyone that was looking forward to playing dodgeball.
LOL
Quote from: RoneKiln on August 12, 2021, 01:50:35 AM
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on August 12, 2021, 01:32:16 AM
I am seeing more and more evidence that the population I live among does not understand the indoor aerosol suspension factor spread of covid. Or, for that matter, even know what aerosols are outside of something that's being sprayed by a can.
Or that a mask, were one to choose to wear one, needs to cover their mouth AND nose or wearing it is useless except to catch the heavy spit particles expelled when talking.
Many here just pull them over their mouths and breathe through their noses. Neither mitigating intake of others breath, nor preventing their breath being expelled to protect their fellow man.
Besides, many here think COVID is over for them now that they are fully vaccinated. There are at least a couple here I've heard say they haven't heard we're in another wave because of Delta. Or what the Delta variant is.
For someone with a compromised immune system this is crazy making.
Well, to be fair to them, the media system our society relies on for continuing education throughout adulthood mixed up the pandemic crisis education with a hybrid course on creative writing and low grade reality tv shows.
This is sort of like walking into gym class to find you're taking a pop quiz on advanced physics. We're the nerds from the math club smirking at everyone that was looking forward to playing dodgeball.
Just remember , the nerds from the math club usually ended up with their underwear pulled up to their shoulders and locked inside a locker. ( By the dodgeball players.) Hubris only takes you so far and being the smartest kid in the room is moot when you're stuck head first into the trash can
drat
Just to be clear to what I was alluding to in my last post. In the last two weeks since my wife and I went back to wearing masks when going to stores. I've noticed sour looks directed at us by non mask wearing shoppers. Which I guess bothers me more than it should since our wearing masks is for their benefit , as our masks do nothing to protect us
Quote from: flybynight on August 12, 2021, 09:55:02 AM
Quote from: RoneKiln on August 12, 2021, 01:50:35 AM
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on August 12, 2021, 01:32:16 AM
I am seeing more and more evidence that the population I live among does not understand the indoor aerosol suspension factor spread of covid. Or, for that matter, even know what aerosols are outside of something that's being sprayed by a can.
Or that a mask, were one to choose to wear one, needs to cover their mouth AND nose or wearing it is useless except to catch the heavy spit particles expelled when talking.
Many here just pull them over their mouths and breathe through their noses. Neither mitigating intake of others breath, nor preventing their breath being expelled to protect their fellow man.
Besides, many here think COVID is over for them now that they are fully vaccinated. There are at least a couple here I've heard say they haven't heard we're in another wave because of Delta. Or what the Delta variant is.
For someone with a compromised immune system this is crazy making.
Well, to be fair to them, the media system our society relies on for continuing education throughout adulthood mixed up the pandemic crisis education with a hybrid course on creative writing and low grade reality tv shows.
This is sort of like walking into gym class to find you're taking a pop quiz on advanced physics. We're the nerds from the math club smirking at everyone that was looking forward to playing dodgeball.
Just remember , the nerds from the math club usually ended up with their underwear pulled up to their shoulders and locked inside a locker. ( By the dodgeball players.) Hubris only takes you so far and being the smartest kid in the room is moot when you're stuck head first into the trash can
Then they became the successful software engineers as adults. :spitscreen:
I'm really trying to advocate for some empathy for everyone that doesn't follow the news closely or gave up trying to keep up with the insanity in the corporate entertainment media. A lot of people were set up to fail. Yes, people can overcome that, but it doesn't seem the norm.
Forbes (https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2021/08/09/some-may-be-getting-covid-19-vaccines-in-disguise-to-hide-vaccination-status/?fbclid=IwAR1xZhM2nY1EyXq4c6ilymk8smRgFjEsCaUZv09pPf3lTzbwLNSCOdOjSyc&sh=36e8b47f2ff3)
Some May Be Getting Covid-19 Vaccines In Disguise To Hide Vaccination Status
Apparently some people who want to get vaccinated against Covid-19 may be facing high school-type peer pressure or even bullying.
Priscilla Frase, MD, the chief medical information officer for Ozarks Healthcare, described how her patients said they actually had to don disguises while getting vaccinated so that their family members and peers wouldn't find out. They've turned getting vaccinated and taking Covid-19 precautions into us versus them cliques.
I have a malignant fear that the entire covid pandemic is not the result of a lab leak, or unfortunate coincidence. But that it is a biological weapon attack by a nation with little regard for human life in a gamble for world domination without engaging in a protracted and possibly nuclear war
Quote from: flybynight on August 14, 2021, 08:25:56 AM
I have a malignant fear that the entire covid pandemic is not the result of a lab leak, or unfortunate coincidence. But that it is a biological weapon attack by a nation with little regard for human life in a gamble for world domination without engaging in a protracted and possibly nuclear war
More of a calculated risk than gambling - but only if it had been genetically designed to attack sub-species within the human race.
So maybe a lab leak of an incomplete design?
Quote from: Tony D Tiger on August 14, 2021, 09:10:15 AM
Quote from: flybynight on August 14, 2021, 08:25:56 AM
I have a malignant fear that the entire covid pandemic is not the result of a lab leak, or unfortunate coincidence. But that it is a biological weapon attack by a nation with little regard for human life in a gamble for world domination without engaging in a protracted and possibly nuclear war
More of a calculated risk than gambling - but only if it had been genetically designed to attack sub-species within the human race.
So maybe a lab leak of an incomplete design?
What need for a sub species specific pathogen? When a government views people as only a resource to ensure their control and power. Sub species would matter little to them.
There is some bollocks being spouted in this thread.
I think it's very understandable to have fears on the borderline of rationality, and sometimes those fears prove more relevant than we ever imagined. I don't think there's anything wrong with being able to discuss and face those fears.
In this mode of communication, it's very easy for responsible discussion of those concerns to drift off into less constructive discussions. Or discussions that may be constructive for regulars that know and trust one another, but not so constructive for those that casually drop into the forum from time to time.
Let's please be careful to keep in mind that while most of us are fair decent acquaintances that can give one another a lot of lattitude, we're also on a semipublic platform geared towards helping others prepare for the trials and tribulations of life.
*Official Admin post*
I don't often flex my epeen, but I am an Admin, I just dont wear the uniform. As such, I ask everyone in this thread to tread carefully.
Please make note of RoneKiln's point below.
QuoteIn this mode of communication, it's very easy for responsible discussion of those concerns to drift off into less constructive discussions. Or discussions that may be constructive for regulars that know and trust one another, but not so constructive for those that casually drop into the forum from time to time.
Please keep on topic. Please take a deep breath before posting and try to post facts, not opinions.
It's much easier to L&B a thread than try to weed out issues...
Okay...
One of my friends got the vaccination. He was born the same year I was, has similar health issues and his doctor said "Yeah, you better get vaccinated, if you get Covid, it will kill you!"
My doctor said "IF you get Covid, it will probably kill you, BUT you will be equally endangered by the vaccine. Don't get vaccinated." (BTW, the last time I got a flu shot, it put me in the hospital for 5 days, 2 of them in ICU)
The main difference between me and my friend:
I have massive allergies, many of them medical (allergies to medications....lots of them). I also have sensitivities. For example, I am not allergic to codeine, however if I take it I will puke to the point I will wish it had killed me! Besides most painkillers having that affect on me, I am allergic to penicillin and most everything related to it, plus I am sensitive to many of the non-penicillin antibiotics (massive vomiting, some cause me to get a high fever, still others give me uncontrollable diarrhea, etc.)
So, I am stuck in a medical limbo zone.
Dammed if I do, dammed if I don't.
I know some places have started the *vaccine passport* deal, and some jobs are requiring vaccination.
Where does that leave people like me?
Will there be a documentation required from a physician in order to travel or keep your job, etc?
I am genuinely worried about this.
Dang rough place to find yourself in, Lambykins. Dang rough. Would that I could offer you more than my typed support on the internet. But, like that little drummer boy, I have no gifts to give you other than please know you will be specially held in my thoughts for the duration.
Or I could play my drum for you if you'd prefer because I do have a Bodhran. 🤗
Maybe a bit of both to give ya a laugh during this rough time?
Quote from: Lambykins on August 14, 2021, 04:21:40 PM
I know some places have started the *vaccine passport* deal, and some jobs are requiring vaccination.
Where does that leave people like me?
Will there be a documentation required from a physician in order to travel or keep your job, etc?
I am genuinely worried about this.
That's a very real thing to be concerned about. Get your doctor to put in writing what they advised and why they advised it. There are some very strongly enforced federal laws protecting people with documented medical issues. It would suck to have to resort to leaning on those laws, but being ready to lean on those laws may reduce the odds you need to in the first place.
I'd get copies of what your doctor writes to your HR as well.
Thanks to all for the good wishes and suggestions.
First: We do not have a "HR" aka Human Resources department.
You got a problem with another employee or a situation at work?
Go in Lance or Brenda's office, kick the door shut, sit down and explain what is going on, why it is pissing you off and what you think they oughta do about it.
Use common sense. Don't rant and rave about someone "misgendering" you or sexual harassing you if you haven't told them to stop and corrected them yourself. Don't report someone's activities outside of work if it doesn't impact on their work behavior/performance. Lance doesn't give a shit if someone drinks themselves blackout drunk every night...as long as they aren't drunk at work and they can do their job.
Second: Lance has made it abundantly clear that the store WILL follow mask mandates and the like, BUT he will NOT interfere with an employees personal choices for their health care. We have *vaxxers* and *anti-vaxxers* both that work at the store. EVERYONE follows hygiene directives; i.e.; hand sanitizer every 20 minutes for cashiers, immediately after handling packages of raw meat, etc. Wash hands thoroughly every 2 hours or after bathroom break.
What genuinely concerns me is any travel I engage in. I know I can't go to Canada (20 minutes away) because you must have a vaccine passport to go there. (limited border crossings are now allowed with vaccine passport)
Vermont (less than a mile away from where I sit right now) has started rumbling about requiring it to attend certain social events there. (I have a friend getting married there in the Spring)
Concerts or any performing arts are going to be completely out of the question, I'm afraid.
I don't go to things like that very often, but I suspect I won't be going to any at all in the future.
Very glad my job doesn't entail travel...wondering what cross country truck drivers will have to face if they have to get vaccine passports if they have medical issues like I do!
Reuters
Israel's COVID-19 vaccine boosters show signs of taming Delta
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/israels-covid-19-vaccine-boosters-050000302.html
Seeing more masks around here. Not mandated anywhere yet.
The governor of Virginia recently mandated that all state employees either be vaccinated or undergo regular testing as of some time in September. My husband is responsible for acquiring Covid tests for the largest department in the largest agency in the state. There are no tests available on that scale. He's scrambling to find a contractor who can supply them and he won't be the only one.
This kind of requirement is being issued by many employers and governments across the country. I expect the spike in demand will create a shortage over the next few months that will leave many employees in a limbo of violating mandates due to there being no tests available to take.
This is from the BBC World Service 'Coronavirus Global Update'
I have been as yet unable to corroborate it in written word on internet. On the other hand, having followed its near daily 5 minute updates since March 2020, I have not seen them do salacious or clickbait type of reporting, nor do they do commentary reporting.
QuoteReports from Japan say venues for the Tokyo Olympics & Paralympics could temporarily be turned into coronavirus medical centers.
The country is [tacking? tracking? attacking?] a surge in cases and wants to ease pressure on the health system.
Japan is into its fifth wave of the coronavirus and emergency measures have been extended.
Built, ready & waiting. 👍
EDIT: Now I find it <facepalm>
Tokyo Mulls Over Converting Olympic Facilities into Temporary COVID-19 Hospitals (https://japan-forward.com/tokyo-mulls-over-converting-olympic-facilities-into-temporary-covid-19-hospitals/)
"While the local government must wait until after the Paralympics to convert the venues, it has set up 100-plus bed "oxygen stations" for patients at risk but with less serious symptoms."
Tokyo (Reuters) (https://ca.news.yahoo.com/tokyo-weighs-olympic-venues-temporary-071325262.html)
"Authorities in the Japanese capital are considering plans to convert some of the city's Olympics and Paralympics venues into temporary medical facilities as they combat soaring COVID-19 infections that have piled pressure on the healthcare system.
"Medical experts have urged temporary use of facilities owned by the Tokyo government, such as the Tokyo Aquatics Centre, site of swimming competitions, and the Musashino Forest Sport Plaza used for badminton, the Sankei newspaper said.
"However, the earliest they could be drafted into use would be after the Paralympic Games."
( Same BBC report as above)
QuoteA new study in the UK will test how many antibodies participants have after testing positive for covid.
"Adults in Britain who test positive for covid-19 are to be invited to take part in a study to gage the effectiveness of vaccinations."
To me 'this' will be an important study as we continue to try to figure this virus out and work on reeling it into managable.
Once again, Go Brits.
Japan is very likely going to put those venues to good use in that capacity. They have the highest rate of antivax sentiment in the world that existed way before Andrew Wakefield falsified data and played a significant part in sending the western world into an antivax tizzy. Distrust of vaccines in Japan is at least founded on the reality of poorly developed vaccines in that country in the past.
Johns Hopkins (https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-long-haulers-long-term-effects-of-covid19)
"But what's curious is that it seems post-COVID-19 syndrome is not just afflicting people who were very sick with the coronavirus. "Patients who were never severely ill are coming to clinic and reporting that their lives are different now,"
UCDavis (https://health.ucdavis.edu/coronavirus/covid-19-information/covid-19-long-haulers.html)
Harvard Medical (https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/the-tragedy-of-the-post-covid-long-haulers-202010152479)
Nature (https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-021-03553-9), a British weekly scientific journal founded and based in London, England.
University of Kansas Health System (https://www.kansashealthsystem.com/news-room/blog/2021/01/lasting-effects-of-covid-19)
"While the lives lost to COVID-19 are carefully and consistently counted, what's less understood is the number of people who survive the disease, yet are plagued for weeks or months with COVID-19's potentially devastating toll on the body."
One of the largest studies of Covid-19 "long haulers" (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-22/-long-hauler-study-shows-covid-can-kill-months-after-infection)
" "We're starting to see a little bit beneath that iceberg, and it's really alarming.
"The excess mortality translates into about 8 extra deaths per 1,000 patients -- worsening the pandemic's hidden toll amid growing recognition that many patients require readmission, and some die, weeks after the viral infection abates."
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-long-haul-hospitals-pediatric-units-children/ (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/covid-long-haul-hospitals-pediatric-units-children/)
"At least five hospitals in the U.S. have started pediatric long-haul clinics to help kids with lingering COVID-19 illness."
So, Sturgis happened.
And this happened...
https://www.thedailybeast.com/sturgis-rally-is-what-a-vaccine-era-coronavirus-superspreader-event-looks-like (https://www.thedailybeast.com/sturgis-rally-is-what-a-vaccine-era-coronavirus-superspreader-event-looks-like)
We have a huge interest in motorcycles up where I live. A lot of it is because helmets aren't required here.
And a great many local motorcycle enthusiasts went to Sturgis and came back.
Everywhere in New Hampshire is showing higher levels now.
Quote from: Lambykins on August 26, 2021, 07:45:02 AM
So, Sturgis happened.
And this happened...
https://www.thedailybeast.com/sturgis-rally-is-what-a-vaccine-era-coronavirus-superspreader-event-looks-like (https://www.thedailybeast.com/sturgis-rally-is-what-a-vaccine-era-coronavirus-superspreader-event-looks-like)
We have a huge interest in motorcycles up where I live. A lot of it is because helmets aren't required here.
And a great many local motorcycle enthusiasts went to Sturgis and came back.
Everywhere in New Hampshire is showing higher levels now.
<shaking head muttering to myself>
And I love me some riding! Even used to own a Matchless 500 back in the day. Never used a helmet. (wayyyy back in the day) Always been a dream to ride the Sturgis event.
But seriously? Now? Come
on.
That is too cool. Ever, Can you get anymore cool?
Quote from: flybynight on August 26, 2021, 07:28:24 PM
That is too cool. Ever, Can you get anymore cool?
😀 Clearly my life in the typed word is much cooler than the observing of it in RT. 😎 So, given that supposition, I bet I could type myself cooler. Nice. And speaking about Mt. Everest....
The research abstract (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jth.15517)
Pre-hospital antiplatelet therapy, most commonly aspirin, was associated with significantly lower in-hospital mortality rates for COVID-19 patients, according to a study this week in the Journal of Thrombosis and Haemostasis.
The researchers matched 6,781 COVID-19 US patients who received antiplatelet therapy before hospital admission with 10,566 who did not receive antiplatelet therapy from February to September 2020.
The Study: High-risk allergy patients have low reaction rates to Pfizer vaccine (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2783626)
From Dec 27, 2020, to Feb 22, 2021, 8,102 Israeli patients with allergies applied to the COVID-19 vaccine referral center at the Sheba Medical Center near Tel Aviv.
Of 429 patients considered to be high-risk for allergic reactions against the Pfizer/BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine, 98% had no allergic reaction, according to a JAMA Network Open
Research on the impact of coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19) on healthcare-associated infections in 2020 (https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/infection-control-and-hospital-epidemiology/article/impact-of-coronavirus-disease-2019-covid19-on-healthcareassociated-infections-in-2020-a-summary-of-data-reported-to-the-national-healthcare-safety-network/8197F323F4840D233A0C62F4726287E1)
Significant increases in the national SIRs for CLABSI, CAUTI, VAE, and MRSA bacteremia were observed in 2020. Changes in the SIR varied by quarter and state. The largest increase was observed for CLABSI, and significant increases in VAE incidence and ventilator utilization were seen across all 4 quarters of 2020.
The accompanying editorial (https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/infection-control-and-hospital-epidemiology/article/healthcareassociated-infections-during-the-coronavirus-disease-2019-covid19-pandemic/81E1C620D606E0E5C4874C2A6598DACB)
"Nurses and doctors were trying to save the lives of surges of critically ill infectious patients while juggling shortages of respirators and, at times, shortages of gowns, gloves, and disinfectant wipes as well."
In addition, some hospital staff were asked to perform tasks they had not previously performed. All available resources were directed at minimizing the risk of SARS-CoV-2 transmission in the hospital. Sometimes these efforts went wrong.
"As the number of COVID-19 cases surge, hospitals are becoming overwhelmed with more patients than can be managed with typical care standards."
My personal addition:
Nurses, doctors, care staff working for weeks at a time with too little sleep, little to 'no' down time to even process what they were seeing. Sometimes with the crush of patients so strong and relentless they were having to choose who gets treated, for a disease they were learning about and how to treat on the fly. Working in traumatic conditions, losing count of those they couldn't save, for weeks on end.
Wrong conditions for everything to go right.
For over a year I've thought of trying to write a post on 4th generation warfare. For those not familiar with it, a short lazy definition is the weaponizing of the populace through media and language. Very recently I've heard some refer to it as 5th generation warfare, as I guess some scholar(s) decided to better differentiate some earlier styles of warfare and bump up the number by one.
Either way, the idea of weaponizing the civilian populace.
But I've not invested the effort in brushing up on it well enough to write a good post aimed towards prepping.
This occurs to me here because it's getting real hard for me to sift through data on treatments for covid amongst the media hysteria, and I think that may get worse with future pandemics. I'm seeing what seems to me crazy media conflict over possible treatments that is impacting the ability of researchers to explore possibilities and for doctors to prescribe them.
If anyone else is trying to make sense not just of the data, but some of the media and social conflict framing the data, looking up 4th/5th generation warfare might help you understand or articulate to others some of what we're seeing. I do not mean to imply an organized malevolent actor is driving this. I think a mix of human nature, search/social media algorithms, and media struggling for ratings can drive this without anyone intentionally steering.
I think we will continue seeing this problem with other pandemics and health related issues in the future. Being aware of social dynamics driving human behavior may be intrinsically tied to being able to understand the scientific data being made available. It may also help keep you from dismissing important data some might malign as being "from the other side."
Please do if you find that time and the desire to write it lines up. It sounds interesting, more than that, important.
You're talking about a paradigm shift, right?
Were my research posts what made it return to mind? If so, and if there was flaw in the data, sources, or it was skewed in a way I didn't recognize, it is in my best interest to be better informed.
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on September 04, 2021, 12:22:36 AM
Please do if you find that time and the desire to write it lines up. It sounds interesting, more than that, important.
You're talking about a paradigm shift, right?
Were my research posts what made it return to mind? If so, and if there was flaw in the data, sources, or it was skewed in a way I didn't recognize, it is in my best interest to be better informed.
No, I didn't in any way intend to imply there was anything wrong with any of the studies you posted. Many of us in the last year or two have lamented the sensationalism and politicizing of this pandemic and the concept of 4th/5th generation warfare has often been on my mind. I saw what appears to me another peak in the media hysteria this last week and I thought it better to post something lazy than nothing at all.
I also don't think the current cultural problems in the US are going to improve soon. I think our cultural issues will continue to heavily influence medical/health research, reporting, and policy.
One in 5,000: The Real Chances of a Breakthrough Infection
https://www.yahoo.com/news/one-5-000-real-chances-183201138.html
https://nationalfile.com/doctor-wants-to-be-scary-to-the-public-and-inflate-covid-numbers-if-you-dont-get-vaccinated-you-know-youre-going-to-die/
QuoteAfter the first speaker seems to answer a question about how COVID-19 patient counts are determined and shared with the public, MacDonald responds, "I guess my feeling at this point in time is, maybe we need to be completely a little bit more scary to the public." She then introduces her idea to inflate the total number of COVID-19 patients by counting patients who recovered. "There are many people still hospitalized that we're considering post-COVID, but they're not counted in those numbers," Rudyk explains, "So how do we include those post-COVID people in the numbers of the patients we have in the hospital?"
At this point Fisher, apparently confused, asks Rudyk to clarify if she is suggesting the hospital release the total number of patients treated at the hospital "since the beginning of COVID," which Rudyk says is an even better idea.
"That's better still, and that's something that I can take to someone else, but I think those are important numbers. The patients that are still in the hospital, that are off the COVID floor, but still are occupying the hospital for a variety of reasons," said Rudyk, before a male doctor interrupted to inform her that those patients are considered "recovered."
Still she persists: "I think that that needs to be highlighted as well, because once you're off isolation you drop from the COVID numbers, that's exactly right." The male doctor agreed, "Carolyn, we can talk offline about how we run that up to marketing," before being cut off by Rudyk.
"So I just want to say we have to be more blunt, we have to be more forceful, we have to see something coming out: 'If you don't get vaccinated, you know you're going to die,'" Rudyk said, laughing. "I mean let's just be really blunt with these people."
Lies, damn lies, and statistics with a healthy dose of fear, uncertainty, and doubt mixed in.
Evidence of 'superhuman' immunity to COVID-19
It's being dubbed 'superhuman immunity'. new research shows some people may have a significantly higher level of immunity to COVID-19 that could even protect them from future pandemics.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/evidence-superhuman-immunity-covid-19-092149813.html
Is this the last major wave ?
New COVID-19 cases are now falling across most of the country, and experts predict that the U.S. pandemic may finally be starting to peter out.
https://news.yahoo.com/the-last-major-wave-of-infection-do-falling-covid-cases-signal-the-end-of-the-us-pandemic-203343478.html
Quote from: flybynight on September 07, 2021, 07:47:21 PM
One in 5,000: The Real Chances of a Breakthrough Infection
https://www.yahoo.com/news/one-5-000-real-chances-183201138.html (https://www.yahoo.com/news/one-5-000-real-chances-183201138.html)
Ooh, lucky me! :icon_crazy:
We just had our last wave of ATV and *leaf peeper* tourists.
Our numbers went WAY up, despite having some of the highest vaccination rates in the country.
Now, hunting season is upon us. :headbang:
In the meantime, I know EIGHT people (one a co-worker) that tested positive over the last 7 days.
Go home people.
Just stop it.
Missing grouse or pheasant season will not destroy your life.
Same for when deer season hits or moose, bear, etc.
Just STOP.
We have a 12 bed hospital. You will be transported to Dartmouth or Manchester. That's over two hours.
If they are overloaded (which happens to be the case right now), you'll travel down to Concord. Another 30 to 45 minutes.
I'm just so tired of the whole damn thing.
I just looked at my county dashboard and it's pretty nonsensical. There's an insane disparity in numbers depending on whether your break it down by age vs region.
According to the breakdown by age, half the population in the county caught it in the last two weeks (it specifies new cases, not cumulative). I suspect someone screwed up the number scale on the Y axis of the graph. Cause I'm not hearing of any outbreaks.
According to the breakdown by region of the county, the average flu season is far more of an issue than Covid has been recently. We're in double digits over the last two weeks combined.
So my region is somewhere between a few dozen and tens of thousands for new cases. :smiley_chinrub:
Over 80% of the adult population is at least partially vacccinated. Over 70% is fully vaccinated.
Nearly 60% of kids 12 to 18 are vaccinated.
Given our high vaccination rate, actual cases could potentially be far higher than the breakdown by region indicates, but people may not be showing enough symptoms to be tested.
Emergency rooms and intensive care units have regularly been running at or beyond capacity in my region for over two decades. So I don't know what to make of claims of overwhelmed medical systems during covid. I always assumed overwhelmed emergency rooms was normal. Obviously a pandemic would overwhelm them even more, but I don't hear anything that conveys how much more.
QuoteIs this the last major wave?
That would be lovely. Though I think this will not prove to be the case. I will be happy if I am wrong.
We are in a journey with this variant, here and around the world. And I don't think we should be surprised to see continuing pop-up outbreaks into 2022 because this variant is going to do what it does expertly: Seek out and dig into any purchase and advantage it can find. And we as humans, unfortunately, are going to continue doing what we do.
The reported cases will go down where they were high, precautions will be relaxed, a period of relative quiet will follow while delta is free to continue hunting. Then another wave of pop-up breakouts will begin. Repeat.
It's all happened before... numerous times with this variant.
And the holidays are coming. So, basically, we're going to continue to screw ourselves because that's what we've done for going on 20 months. And feed ourselves to the variant, this one, or who knows what's coming in it's wake.
I will be grateful if this does not prove to be the case.
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on October 14, 2021, 04:05:53 AM
The reported cases will go down where they were high, precautions will be relaxed, a period of relative quiet will follow while delta is free to continue hunting. Then another wave of pop-up breakouts will begin. Repeat.
It's all happened before... numerous times with this variant.
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.e32894d7735f42a1624636cc44abf3a9?rik=NxhvU9bP8WTU7g&riu=http%3a%2f%2fmedia-cache-ak0.pinimg.com%2f736x%2fb5%2fbf%2fb8%2fb5bfb88fdf4675abdcf77b63c1e9a7ad.jpg&ehk=IzjMPUDzw15ZJcuXfBquyq2vot3Wi1LeTEwmtwYq1YA%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0)
Frakking toasters.
Quote from: Mr. E. Monkey on October 14, 2021, 08:19:42 AM
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on October 14, 2021, 04:05:53 AM
The reported cases will go down where they were high, precautions will be relaxed, a period of relative quiet will follow while delta is free to continue hunting. Then another wave of pop-up breakouts will begin. Repeat.
It's all happened before... numerous times with this variant.
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.e32894d7735f42a1624636cc44abf3a9?rik=NxhvU9bP8WTU7g&riu=http%3a%2f%2fmedia-cache-ak0.pinimg.com%2f736x%2fb5%2fbf%2fb8%2fb5bfb88fdf4675abdcf77b63c1e9a7ad.jpg&ehk=IzjMPUDzw15ZJcuXfBquyq2vot3Wi1LeTEwmtwYq1YA%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0)
Frakking toasters.
👍 nuBSG
picture: Starbuck
Quote from: Mr. E. Monkey on October 14, 2021, 08:19:42 AM
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on October 14, 2021, 04:05:53 AM
The reported cases will go down where they were high, precautions will be relaxed, a period of relative quiet will follow while delta is free to continue hunting. Then another wave of pop-up breakouts will begin. Repeat.
It's all happened before... numerous times with this variant.
(https://th.bing.com/th/id/R.e32894d7735f42a1624636cc44abf3a9?rik=NxhvU9bP8WTU7g&riu=http%3a%2f%2fmedia-cache-ak0.pinimg.com%2f736x%2fb5%2fbf%2fb8%2fb5bfb88fdf4675abdcf77b63c1e9a7ad.jpg&ehk=IzjMPUDzw15ZJcuXfBquyq2vot3Wi1LeTEwmtwYq1YA%3d&risl=&pid=ImgRaw&r=0)
Frakking toasters.
:smiley_clap:
This is why we put up with the feces throwing.
Quote from: RoneKiln on October 15, 2021, 12:43:19 AM
This is why we put up with the feces throwing.
The feces throwing has happened before, and will happen again, too. :awesome:
In all seriousness, as much as I just
had to drop the reference there, because it fit so well, I'm really not sure I
like that it fits, you know? It does not leave me with a warm, fuzzy feeling. :-[
(https://starbaseatlanta.com/wp-content/uploads/swnmr94285.jpg)
Quote from: Mr. E. Monkey on October 15, 2021, 08:16:06 AM
Quote from: RoneKiln on October 15, 2021, 12:43:19 AM
This is why we put up with the feces throwing.
The feces throwing has happened before, and will happen again, too. :awesome:
In all seriousness, as much as I just had to drop the reference there, because it fit so well, I'm really not sure I like that it fits, you know? It does not leave me with a warm, fuzzy feeling. :-[
(https://starbaseatlanta.com/wp-content/uploads/swnmr94285.jpg)
Me either.
ZS thread, 'Delta variant B.1.617.2', Sat May 15, 2021 1:38 am, OP, Ever
"This variant from India, B.1.617.2, gives me the same growing anxiety I remember having when I began following the unknown pneumonia in Wuhan....
(I'm having a bad feeling about this one)"
Ten states file suit against the White House's vaccine mandate for federal contractors, https://content.govdelivery.com/attachments/MTAG/2021/10/29/file_attachments/1980934/2021-10-29%20-%20States%20v.%20Biden%20-%20Federal%20Contractor%20Vaccine%20Mandate%20-%20Complaint%20-%20Final.pdf
QuoteThrough Executive Order 14042, President Biden has arrogated to the Executive Branch the unilateral power to mandate that all employees of federal contractors be vaccinated. This power grab is sweeping in its scope. Employees of federal contractors constitute one-fifth of the total U.S. workforce. And the mandate goes so far as to demand vaccination even from employees who work entirely within their own home. That is unconstitutional, unlawful, and unwise.
So a federal research facility in my AO began contacting their contractor companies about this. That they had to be a fully vaccinated or would not be allowed into the facility. The first company to respond was a Swiss based company that services their autoclave equipment . The company responded that since they are not American owned , they will not comply with the mandate. The research facility contacted higher ups who then said only the technicians who enter the facility have to be vaccinated. The Swiss company responded. We do not force employees to be vaccinated. We consider this to be a termination of our contract by you . Contact us if your requirement to work at your facility changes and we will renegotiate the contract.
Nothing like making it easier for a company to charge more
KSU is requiring all employees to be fully vaccinated by Dec. 9th. 3/4 quarters of said employees are under contract . Meaning if they are terminated in December. They still get paid until June.
I think I ate something that disagreed with me last night and had some stomach issues. Shortly after that one of my crew texts me to warn me they tested positive for covid. Luckily their symptoms are akin to having a cold amd not serious. One of my other crew had thought she might have caught that "cold" before the test result came in and was already thinking of taking today off to be safe.
So my whole department is shut down today and I helped coordinate where we could get tested.
My boss notifies HR and HR says even if I test negative, I'm not allowed in the office for 10 days. That seems extreme and I'm a bit pissed off.
I don't think I have any symptoms today, but I went rock climbing Saturday and regularly have allergies this time of year. So I have some soreness and congestion issues. Which I think I should have anyway. In fact, for the climbing I did Saturday, I should be more sore than I am. So I think I'm good.
Looks like I get a week and a half vacation.
I tested negative for covid after a few lazy days off and my boss had a very firm discussion with HR to get me back in the office. I've always had a great boss but he's already sick of trying to cover my work. So I have to go back to work tomorrow.
My 11-year-old gets her first vaccine shot on Sunday. She is the last member of the household to become eligible, and we have all been pretty careful the past 20 months for her sake since she has previously been hit hard by flu and other bugs with similar symptoms. The concern is that her recovery time and/or long-term effects will be pretty bad.
Looking forward to getting that weight lifted.
Just got my covid booster (Moderna) this afternoon. Last week, at my regular doctor's appointment, I asked him about getting a booster and he strongly recommended it (although he wasn't willing to endorse going with a different type, as the studies on that aren't done yet). CVS had same-day appointments, so it was a quick in/out this afternoon to get it after making the appointment at lunch time.
Nothing yet other than a bit of post-shot sensitivity. For the full shots I was a bit tired and had some joint ache afterwards, but nothing significant. Hopefully it will be even less this time, due to the reduced amount of vaccine in the booster.
Quote from: airballrad on November 04, 2021, 05:03:44 AM
My 11-year-old gets her first vaccine shot on Sunday.
That must be a relief!
My 15-year-old got their single shot of the Pfizer vaccine today (UK kids only get one shot, and Pfizer is the only vax licensed for under-18s). Much as with you, they were the last member of the household and we're now all vaccinated.
Guess who's panic buying now?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/nov/02/chinese-urged-to-stockpile-amid-ongoing-covid-outbreak
But of course the rumor mill then drives the why of doing so in a different direction. I'm not unaware of the very real tensions and reasons that seed the rumors, although that is not yet. This is their growing number of outbreaks and the coming winter.
Welcome to prepping my brothers and sisters in your part of the world.
This is also interesting. The Economist (https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-economist/) suggests the truer numbers of covid related deaths is over 16,000,000.
https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2021/11/02/the-number-of-people-who-have-died-from-covid-19-is-likely-to-be-close-to-17m
Quote from: sheddi on November 04, 2021, 03:43:23 PM
Quote from: airballrad on November 04, 2021, 05:03:44 AM
My 11-year-old gets her first vaccine shot on Sunday.
That must be a relief!
My 15-year-old got their single shot of the Pfizer vaccine today (UK kids only get one shot, and Pfizer is the only vax licensed for under-18s). Much as with you, they were the last member of the household and we're now all vaccinated.
The varied dosing is interesting. In the US, teens get the same as adults. I'm interested in seeing how the numbers differ between the two dosages for teens. Is there a particular reason stated as to why the UK went with a lower dose?
Quote from: Anianna on November 09, 2021, 08:53:59 PM
Quote from: sheddi on November 04, 2021, 03:43:23 PM
Quote from: airballrad on November 04, 2021, 05:03:44 AM
My 11-year-old gets her first vaccine shot on Sunday.
That must be a relief!
My 15-year-old got their single shot of the Pfizer vaccine today (UK kids only get one shot, and Pfizer is the only vax licensed for under-18s). Much as with you, they were the last member of the household and we're now all vaccinated.
The varied dosing is interesting. In the US, teens get the same as adults. I'm interested in seeing how the numbers differ between the two dosages for teens. Is there a particular reason stated as to why the UK went with a lower dose?
Most of the benefit comes with the first dose, most of the problems with the second dose. The favourable cost/benefit ratio, although still there, is less pronounced in kids than adults.
ETA : lots more here
BBC News - Covid: Single jab recommended for 12 to 15-year-olds by UK's top doctors
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-58547659
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on November 05, 2021, 04:18:53 AM
This is also interesting. The Economist (https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-economist/) suggests the truer numbers of covid related deaths is over 16,000,000.
https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2021/11/02/the-number-of-people-who-have-died-from-covid-19-is-likely-to-be-close-to-17m (https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2021/11/02/the-number-of-people-who-have-died-from-covid-19-is-likely-to-be-close-to-17m)
That
is interesting. Looking at their cumulative charts, it seems the vast majority of these estimated excess deaths are in Asia. I am guessing they might not trust the numbers coming out of China? Either way, it would be interesting to see how they reached this conclusion.
Are efforts to end the pandemic just prolonging it?
Quote from: NT2C on December 03, 2021, 08:56:15 AM
Are efforts to end the pandemic just prolonging it?
I thought that was the openly expressed intent behind the efforts to "flatten the curve."
Hi everyone! Sorry for my absence, it's all been a bit crazy busy.
Mrs Sheddi and me are both now triple-jabbed, Experiment #1 is double-jabbed and Experiment #2 will be eligible for a second shot in the New Year.
Omicron is all over the news here in the UK. According to TPTB cases are doubling every 2 days or less, mask mandates are back and COVID passports are required (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/0/covid-pass-vaccine-passport-uk-nhs-app-plan-b-2021/) to get into nightclubs and large events.
My holiday plans aren't particularly complicated - hoping to visit relatives - but could yet need revision.
Thanks for bumping sheddi - forgot about this topic.
I got my booster shot last week. First dose was J&J booster was Moderna.
Results - it knocked my on my rear. Got the shot at ~215p, was in bed unconscious by 6pm. Back up at ~90% next AM at 4am... Following day was continued improvement...
Quote from: SCBrian on December 15, 2021, 06:46:41 PM
Thanks for bumping sheddi - forgot about this topic.
I got my booster shot last week. First dose was J&J booster was Moderna.
Results - it knocked my on my rear. Got the shot at ~215p, was in bed unconscious by 6pm. Back up at ~90% next AM at 4am... Following day was continued improvement...
I've been worried because the reports regarding immune deficiency say that I only have about a 50% chance that the vaccines are working for me at all. I didn't get sick when I got my shots (all Pfizer), so I'm thinking that could maybe be a sign that I'm one of the 50% for which it's not able to kick my immunity into gear.
I'm glad you're feeling better and I suspect you're decently protected! Thank you, all of you who have gotten the vaccines, for being part of creating a safer environment for people like me.
Quote from: Anianna on December 23, 2021, 11:21:48 PM
Quote from: SCBrian on December 15, 2021, 06:46:41 PM
Thanks for bumping sheddi - forgot about this topic.
I got my booster shot last week. First dose was J&J booster was Moderna.
Results - it knocked my on my rear. Got the shot at ~215p, was in bed unconscious by 6pm. Back up at ~90% next AM at 4am... Following day was continued improvement...
I've been worried because the reports regarding immune deficiency say that I only have about a 50% chance that the vaccines are working for me at all. I didn't get sick when I got my shots (all Pfizer), so I'm thinking that could maybe be a sign that I'm one of the 50% for which it's not able to kick my immunity into gear.
I'm glad you're feeling better and I suspect you're decently protected! Thank you, all of you who have gotten the vaccines, for being part of creating a safer environment for people like me.
They've said that the harder the shot/booster hits you, the better your protection is likely to be, since you're demonstrating a strong immune response to the shot. I'm vaxxed and boosted, all of it with Moderna. I've talked with several people who were like me - fine for the first few hours, then really, really need to take a nap! After waking back up, I just had some soreness at the injection point and my joints ached a bit for a few days.
Drudge had these numbers up today, not sure where they were pulled from.
COVID CASES USA
265,032 DEC 23 2021
193,511 DEC 23 2020
DEATHS
3,287 DEC 23 2021
3,412 DEC 23 2020
I know deaths lag new cases by about a couple weeks, but just using these daily totals the Covid recovery rate on 12/23/2020 was 98.24% and in 2021 is 98.76%.
A 0.5% reduction in case-fatality year over year.
The Total Vaccine Doses Administered in the US is 498,637,703 (https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6), for a decrease in the case-fatality rate of 0.5%. Even attributing every life saved as being a result of vaccination that's a Number Needed to Vaccinate (NNTV) of 200, or one fatality averted for every 200 vaccine doses administered.
Not far off the number predicted (https://www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4347/rr-4) from the original Pfizer vaccine trial data in Nov 2020, and that was largely 'fact checked' as misleading or misinformation by the media at the time.
My brother just got told that Texas is out of monoclonal antibodies until January.
I'm glad we did not go visit them over Christmas.
So, can somebody help me out here? Omicron is a more contagious form of Covid-19, right? But it's also weaker, or at least its symptoms are greatly lessened, to the point some people aren't even aware they've had it until tested for it, right? Vaccination works and greatly lessens the severity of the symptoms if you do catch Covid-19, but it requires multiple boosters to maintain that level of protection and carries with it a very small chance of negative reaction to it? Vaccination, apparently, does not prevent reinfection or prevent you from spreading the infection? So-called "natural immunity", immunity gained from being infected and recovering, lasts longer and is stronger than immunity gained through vaccination? Have I got all that straight? Did I get anything wrong or skewed?
If not then... why are we in such a panic over Omicron? Its symptoms seem about on-par with vaccination and it confers better immunity. If that's true, masking and social distancing seem contraindicated. Wasn't one of the main purposes of vaccination to get us to the "herd immunity" level? Well, Omicron seems like it's nature's way of doing that.
So, obviously, I have something wrong because the media and our governments are all still in full-on panic mode, like their heads are on fire and their asses are catching, but what? What am I not understanding?
Quote from: NT2C on January 01, 2022, 02:47:23 PM
So, can somebody help me out here? Omicron is a more contagious form of Covid-19, right? But it's also weaker, or at least its symptoms are greatly lessened, to the point some people aren't even aware they've had it until tested for it, right? Vaccination works and greatly lessens the severity of the symptoms if you do catch Covid-19, but it requires multiple boosters to maintain that level of protection and carries with it a very small chance of negative reaction to it? Vaccination, apparently, does not prevent reinfection or prevent you from spreading the infection? So-called "natural immunity", immunity gained from being infected and recovering, lasts longer and is stronger than immunity gained through vaccination? Have I got all that straight? Did I get anything wrong or skewed?
If not then... why are we in such a panic over Omicron? Its symptoms seem about on-par with vaccination and it confers better immunity. If that's true, masking and social distancing seem contraindicated. Wasn't one of the main purposes of vaccination to get us to the "herd immunity" level? Well, Omicron seems like it's nature's way of doing that.
So, obviously, I have something wrong because the media and our governments are all still in full-on panic mode, like their heads are on fire and their asses are catching, but what? What am I not understanding?
"So-called "natural immunity", immunity gained from being infected and recovering, lasts longer and is stronger than immunity gained through vaccination?" - This one may be off a bit, but I'm willing to review the data. Last I checked, natural immunity from having Covid was weak compared to vaccination. Either way, this is one that we can get again even after an immunity boost, but the impact on our health system could be lessened by a higher vaccination rate keeping people out of hospitals.
I don't see that the government is in panic mode. Quarantine times have been reduced, no new mandates federally, and they've been reporting to the media that Omicron isn't all that bad if you get it.
The media are running amok, as they tend to do with their fearmongering, which is probably contributing to people who have a mild case of Omicron rushing to hospitals where they don't need to be. The current data says if you have Omicron, you can likely convalesce at home without much issue. Some people feel the need to run to a hospital for any little snuffle and that will have an impact when so many of those types needlessly burden the system at once.
The actual data is that Delta is still the variant causing the most hospitalizations and deaths. Omicron is the variant that is getting everything shut down because it spreads like fire and so many people are sick regardless of how sick. It's just that enough people are sick that there aren't enough people not sick to keep things operational in many cases. That doesn't mean those people are in the hospital or dying, they just need some time to recover and there's a lot of them and the way the media wants to report that is, again, fearmongering. It can look a bit scary for so many people to be sick at once, but if the Omicron variant is mild and doesn't have a lot of long-term effects, it's not really much of a big deal and is likely to have more impact on business than health.
The thing with vaccinations is that they tend to work better in populations where vaccination rates are high enough to reach herd immunity (as you mentioned, and this level varies). Historically, we eradicated or near eradicated certain diseases such as smallpox and polio via vaccine mandates, not just by having vaccines available. Measles was nearly eradicated in the US until the antivax movement had it reappearing in populations where vaccination rates have dropped (often in areas with low education rates where Andrew Wakefield and Jenny McCarthy actively push their anti-vaccine advocacy). As long as there is any significant number of unvaccinated within a given population, there will continue to be disease.
Whether Omicron can get us to herd immunity is yet to be seen. It will depend on what kind of effect it has on the immune system. The base disease did not sufficiently boost the immune response. I didn't check the numbers on the delta variant, so that one might provide a stronger immunity on par with or greater than the vaccine. We don't know if this variant will provide a robust response yet, but based on data regarding SARS and previous covid variants, I doubt it will provide a significant enough boost that lasts. Given the nature of the virus, though, even the natural potential immune response will still likely require an annual booster unless better vaccine tech comes along on that front. So far, all immunity to covid, whether natural or induced, wanes over time.
I believe covid will not be eradicated and will continue, but it will reach a baseline that we can live with and occasional outbursts of variants that cause us problems, similar to the flu virus and the H1N1 that has continued since the 1918 pandemic. At some point, the levels will fall off to numbers that can be considered within normal parameters.
I honestly don't think we're in a panic over omicron. I think it's just the media's latest buzzword and most of us are just rolling our eyes while some have mild concerns regarding how so many people being temporarily sick is impacting our daily lives (like the people trying to get home whose flights were canceled due to lack of staffing).
ETA: Preliminary data at this time looks like omicron is providing a robust immune response even to other variants, so maybe this is the catalyst that will put an end to the pandemic.
Every peer reviewed article I've seen on vaccine vs natural immunity shows natural immunity is 13 to 20 times better than vaccines. But I've only seen studies done outside the US.
Lifestyle issues in the US may really throw off how relevant overseas studies are to the US. Obesity really messes with our immune system, and especially so with Covid. Covid can hide in fat from our primary immune systems while sparking a low level immune system in fat to cause significant chronic inflammation (google something to the effect of "covid in fat").
The high obesity rate in the US may make this a far different issue for us than it is elsewhere. Initially I was quite dismissive of the media's extreme reaction. Now I'm not so certain. Though I believe the poor quality of our media industry is causing more harm than good.
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 01, 2022, 07:38:26 PM
Though I believe the poor quality of our media industry is causing more harm than good.
I think that's pretty certain.
Quote from: NT2C on January 01, 2022, 02:47:23 PM
So, can somebody help me out here? Omicron is a more contagious form of Covid-19, right? But it's also weaker, or at least its symptoms are greatly lessened, to the point some people aren't even aware they've had it until tested for it, right? Vaccination works and greatly lessens the severity of the symptoms if you do catch Covid-19, but it requires multiple boosters to maintain that level of protection and carries with it a very small chance of negative reaction to it? Vaccination, apparently, does not prevent reinfection or prevent you from spreading the infection? So-called "natural immunity", immunity gained from being infected and recovering, lasts longer and is stronger than immunity gained through vaccination? Have I got all that straight? Did I get anything wrong or skewed?
If not then... why are we in such a panic over Omicron? Its symptoms seem about on-par with vaccination and it confers better immunity. If that's true, masking and social distancing seem contraindicated. Wasn't one of the main purposes of vaccination to get us to the "herd immunity" level? Well, Omicron seems like it's nature's way of doing that.
So, obviously, I have something wrong because the media and our governments are all still in full-on panic mode, like their heads are on fire and their asses are catching, but what? What am I not understanding?
I'm wondering the same things, if it's basically a naturally attenuated or less lethal version of Covid then for lower-risk individuals with no comorbidities maybe this is the variant you want to contract. Omicron parties anyone?
Saw a headline a few days ago about Omicron and T-Cell response, can't find the article now but it might have been referring to this pre-print study out of South Africa, https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.12.26.21268380v1 T-cells, in my overly simplistic understanding of it, being the "long-term memory" of the immune system that helps the body recognize and respond faster to disease that's been encountered previously.
In the last few days I've listened to around 8 hours of interviews with epidemiologists, virologists, and doctors specializing in health policies and research.
:eek1:
Some of the most depressing material I've ever heard. :gonk:
Leading Oxford vaccine expert warns of giving regular boosters 'unsustainable'
https://newsofamerica.org/2022/01/04/leading-oxford-vaccine-expert-warns-of-giving-regular-boosters-unsustainable/
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 02, 2022, 07:38:36 PM
In the last few days I've listened to around 8 hours of interviews with epidemiologists, virologists, and doctors specializing in health policies and research.
:eek1:
Some of the most depressing material I've ever heard. :gonk:
The more you know, the less you trust that any organization has the best interest of the people even in their top 10 priorities. Including the government and medical systems.
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 02, 2022, 07:38:36 PM
In the last few days I've listened to around 8 hours of interviews with epidemiologists, virologists, and doctors specializing in health policies and research.
:eek1:
Some of the most depressing material I've ever heard. :gonk:
So, who are these people? I would like to take a listen myself.
Since always it has been my nature to ask a lot of questions about something that takes my interest. I get flu, lighter cases, and I never miss a flu shot. And viral pneumonia+shot. And ask questions. Then look stuff up if I can. Viruses are never nice to me. I followed a legal case from beginning to end (couple of years) and collected & studied hundreds of files. Good times.
So one might be able to imagine how my interest could go fro zero to 60 reading a now old mid-Jan '20 headline about a pneumonia?, virus?, taking shape.
And finding out info, original info as best I could, which began personal research that laid in the shade what I used to think was deep diving during that lawsuit.
In the beginning especially nobody in the area affected knew much, and would let go of less for quite a while.
The world's med sciences then became lazer focused from at least a hundred direction. And you're going through everybody learning about this virus from every angle as we went along.
So at first it was catch it all and watch for patterns.
Internet, news, hispitals, virologists, labs, Everyone & everything was saying 'words'. Then we began early reports & emerging data that may/maynot hold. Then more and more.
Eventually, for me it would become 'Where's the original source?' 'What's it's known bias?' 'Has this been replicated?' 'By who?' 'Who are they? What's their bias?' yadda yadda yadda
Eventually curating all I heard and read into data that held up over time. And people in or around directly focused on the virus saying similar things from data my searching indicated confirmable.
Further curating them to those who did not say 'This is what is.' You, know, telling me the full answer was now available... on an ever changing pandemic. And we now couple of years in it and looking back they seemed to be keeping right with the data and changes changes. My most trusted became the couple of them saying here's the data, here are possible trajectories from what we see right now. And when the science updated, they said so.
The best, when they don't know or don't have enough data,..say so loud and firmly so as not to be misunderstood.
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on January 06, 2022, 07:52:48 AM
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 02, 2022, 07:38:36 PM
In the last few days I've listened to around 8 hours of interviews with epidemiologists, virologists, and doctors specializing in health policies and research.
:eek1:
Some of the most depressing material I've ever heard. :gonk:
So, who are these people? I like to take a listen myself.
Since always it has been my nature to ask a lot of questions about something that takes my interest. I get flu, lighter case, and I never miss a flu shot. And viral pneumonia+shot. And ask questions. Then look stuff up if I can. Viruses are never nice to me. I followed a legal case from beginning to end (couple of years) and collected & studied hundreds of files. Good times.
So one might be able to imagine how my interest could go fro zero to 60 reading a now old mid-Jan '20 headline about a pneumonia?, virus?, taking shape.
And finding out info, original info as best I could, laid in the shade what I thought was deep diving on all things big lawsuits.
In the beginning especially nobody in the area knew much, and let go of less for quite a while. The world's med sciences then became lazer focused from at least a hundred direction. And you're going through everybody learning about this virus as we went along.
So at first it was catch it all and watch for patterns.
Internet, news, hispitals, virologists, labs, Everyone & everything was saying words. And we began early reports & emerging data that may/maynot hold.
Eventually, for me it would become 'Where's the original source?' 'What's it's known bias?' 'Has this been replicated?' 'By who?' 'Who are they? What's their bias?' yadda yadda yadda
Eventually curating all that was to be heard or read into data that held up & people in or around directly focused on the virus saying similar. Further curating them to those who did not say 'This is what is.' You, know, telling me the full answer was now available... on an ever changing pandemic, had a now couple of years with it and looking back seemed to be keeping right with the changes. My most trusted saying here's the data, here are possible trajectories from what we see right now, and when new updated science brought new data they said so.
And when they don't know or don't have enough data...say so loud and firmly so as not to be misunderstood.
Not sure which ones RoneKiln is listening to, but I'm currently listening to Dr. Robert Malone's interview with Joe Rogan on Spotify.
Thanks for that. I'll pull it up.
👵
In addition to Malone I listened to John Abramson and Peter McCullough. I listened to some shorter things on YouTube as well but I don't remember their names.
None of them are an attempt at a comprehensive overview of what's going on. They primarily focus on specific problems they're trying to bring attention to.
I'm annoyed with every serious discussion I've heard on the risk from the vaccines in young boys. I'm open to the possibility the vaccine is slightly more dangerous to them than Covid. But it's still an incredibly small risk and they never discuss the benefits of herd resiliency.
It's easy for me to say this cause I don't have kids, but I think I'd accept the ridiculously tiny increase in risk to my kid to significantly reduce the risk he makes someone else sick with a possibly very dangerous illness. It seems a no brainer to me. But I've yet to hear that factored in when people start arguing over the benefit of the vaccine for young boys.
Thanks. I'll pull them up too
👵
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 06, 2022, 09:23:11 PM
I'm annoyed with every serious discussion I've heard on the risk from the vaccines in young boys. I'm open to the possibility the vaccine is slightly more dangerous to them than Covid. But it's still an incredibly small risk and they never discuss the benefits of herd resiliency.
It's easy for me to say this cause I don't have kids, but I think I'd accept the ridiculously tiny increase in risk to my kid to significantly reduce the risk he makes someone else sick with a possibly very dangerous illness. It seems a no brainer to me. But I've yet to hear that factored in when people start arguing over the benefit of the vaccine for young boys.
Beyond the risk of severe adverse events to the vaccine, near term or long term, my inner conspiracy theorist worries about the impact of near universal vaccination with leaky vaccines and a constantly mutating virus.
What was the uncommon 'breakthrough' infections with Alpha is now much more common with Delta and Omicron, so much so that the narrative that vaccination "reduces infection and transmission" has largely been dropped and replaced with "protects against severe illness, hospitalizations, and deaths". Seems to me there's a non-zero risk that a highly virulent strain that would normally burn itself out by killing the host might live (and be spread) by the vaccinated, with the worst case being a Marek's disease type mutation(s) developing where it's nearly 100% lethal to the unvaccinated. What would governments and a few pharmaceutical companies do if they controlled the manufacturing and distribution of a drug that you'll die if you can't obtain? :smiley_chinrub:
Because vaccination does not prevent infection with the virus, Marek's is still transmissible from vaccinated flocks to other birds, including the wild bird population. The first Marek's disease vaccine was introduced in 1970. The disease would cause mild paralysis, with the only identifiable lesions being in neural tissue. Mortality of chickens infected with Marek's disease was quite low. Current strains of Marek virus, decades after the first vaccine was introduced, cause lymphoma formation throughout the chicken's body and mortality rates have reached 100% in unvaccinated chickens. The Marek's disease vaccine is a "leaky vaccine", which means that only the symptoms of the disease are prevented.[12] Infection of the host and the transmission of the virus are not inhibited by the vaccine. This contrasts with most other vaccines, where infection of the host is prevented. Under normal conditions, highly virulent strains of the virus are not selected. A highly virulent strain would kill the host before the virus would have an opportunity to transmit to other potential hosts and replicate. Thus, less virulent strains are selected. These strains are virulent enough to induce symptoms but not enough to kill the host, allowing further transmission. However, the leaky vaccine changes this evolutionary pressure and permits the evolution of highly virulent strains.[13] The vaccine's inability to prevent infection and transmission allows the spread of highly virulent strains among vaccinated chickens. The fitness of the more virulent strains is increased by the vaccine.
The evolution of Marek's disease due to vaccination has had a profound effect on the poultry industry. All chickens across the globe are now vaccinated against Marek's disease (birds hatched in private flocks for laying or exhibition are rarely vaccinated). Highly virulent strains have been selected to the point that any chicken that is unvaccinated will die if infected. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marek's_disease)
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 06, 2022, 09:23:11 PM
I'm annoyed with every serious discussion I've heard on the risk from the vaccines in young boys. I'm open to the possibility the vaccine is slightly more dangerous to them than Covid. But it's still an incredibly small risk and they never discuss the benefits of herd resiliency.
It's easy for me to say this cause I don't have kids, but I think I'd accept the ridiculously tiny increase in risk to my kid to significantly reduce the risk he makes someone else sick with a possibly very dangerous illness. It seems a no brainer to me. But I've yet to hear that factored in when people start arguing over the benefit of the vaccine for young boys.
The problem is, we don't know that it's a ridiculously tiny increase in risk. What if it's causing cardiac problems that will only be found years down the road because they're not currently symptomatic? Have they figured out what about it causes the changes in menstrual cycles in females? I'm not sure what "herd resiliency" is, but since you can still transmit the virus after being fully vaccinated, I don't see protecting others as a reason to possibly do untold damage on an entire generation of children and young adults.
Quote from: CG on January 07, 2022, 06:59:51 AM
Quote from: RoneKiln on January 06, 2022, 09:23:11 PM
I'm annoyed with every serious discussion I've heard on the risk from the vaccines in young boys. I'm open to the possibility the vaccine is slightly more dangerous to them than Covid. But it's still an incredibly small risk and they never discuss the benefits of herd resiliency.
It's easy for me to say this cause I don't have kids, but I think I'd accept the ridiculously tiny increase in risk to my kid to significantly reduce the risk he makes someone else sick with a possibly very dangerous illness. It seems a no brainer to me. But I've yet to hear that factored in when people start arguing over the benefit of the vaccine for young boys.
The problem is, we don't know that it's a ridiculously tiny increase in risk. What if it's causing cardiac problems that will only be found years down the road because they're not currently symptomatic? Have they figured out what about it causes the changes in menstrual cycles in females? I'm not sure what "herd resiliency" is, but since you can still transmit the virus after being fully vaccinated, I don't see protecting others as a reason to possibly do untold damage on an entire generation of children and young adults.
While the vaccine does not immunity, it does still reduce the likelihood of catching it, and shortens the length kf time you are contagious if you do catch it. So it is still providing a lot of resiliency and preventing a lot of infections. Same with the flu shot.
I agree there are also still legitimate concerns about the long term affects of all the vaccines. This is why I am in favor of open discourse and am very disappointed in how those raising valid concerns are attacked.
Crosscut, monopolies are a huge problem in the best of times. Your potential scenario is terrifying, and I think that even if it's an infinitively tiny risk, that risk should be discussed and contingency plans put in place to prevent it.
Ive been very sick for 2 months. Severe nausea and stomach cramps. Doctors cant figure out what it is. Had an endoscopy and colonoscopy in august. Then xrays and a catscan last week. Nothing showed up. So im still in a miserable holding pattern.
My wife is really sick too. But with strep this last couole weeks.
I found at home covid tests for $15 locally. I bought 4 of them. Wife and i both tested negative.
Quote from: Moab on January 08, 2022, 11:18:43 AM
Ive been very sick for 2 months. Severe nausea and stomach cramps. Doctors cant figure out what it is. Had an endoscopy and colonoscopy in august. Then xrays and a catscan last week. Nothing showed up. So im still in a miserable holding pattern.
My wife is really sick too. But with strep this last couole weeks.
I found at home covid tests for $15 locally. I bought 4 of them. Wife and i both tested negative.
I have a condition called dysautonomia. Mine comes as a comorbidity with a genetic connective tissue disorder I have, but I have encountered in our support groups an influx of new dysautonomia sufferers who have been diagnosed following covid. Stomach cramping and nausea are some of the symptoms I live with pretty much always. If your scans don't provide an answer, perhaps ask your doctor if you can get a referral to a neurologist who can determine if you have acquired a dysfunction of the autonomic nervous system following covid.
Quote from: Anianna on January 08, 2022, 01:09:12 PM
Quote from: Moab on January 08, 2022, 11:18:43 AM
Ive been very sick for 2 months. Severe nausea and stomach cramps. Doctors cant figure out what it is. Had an endoscopy and colonoscopy in august. Then xrays and a catscan last week. Nothing showed up. So im still in a miserable holding pattern.
My wife is really sick too. But with strep this last couole weeks.
I found at home covid tests for $15 locally. I bought 4 of them. Wife and i both tested negative.
I have a condition called dysautonomia. Mine comes as a comorbidity with a genetic connective tissue disorder I have, but I have encountered in our support groups an influx of new dysautonomia sufferers who have been diagnosed following covid. Stomach cramping and nausea are some of the symptoms I live with pretty much always. If your scans don't provide an answer, perhaps ask your doctor if you can get a referral to a neurologist who can determine if you have acquired a dysfunction of the autonomic nervous system following covid.
Wow. I will do that.
Quote from: Moab on January 08, 2022, 11:18:43 AM
Ive been very sick for 2 months. Severe nausea and stomach cramps. Doctors cant figure out what it is. Had an endoscopy and colonoscopy in august. Then xrays and a catscan last week. Nothing showed up. So im still in a miserable holding pattern.
My wife is really sick too. But with strep this last couole weeks.
I found at home covid tests for $15 locally. I bought 4 of them. Wife and i both tested negative.
Hope you feel better.
The scopes should have ruled out Diverticulitis and a few others, but what about Celiac disease? Have you tried working on an elimination diet?
Quote from: SCBrian on January 09, 2022, 08:51:05 AM
Quote from: Moab on January 08, 2022, 11:18:43 AM
Ive been very sick for 2 months. Severe nausea and stomach cramps. Doctors cant figure out what it is. Had an endoscopy and colonoscopy in august. Then xrays and a catscan last week. Nothing showed up. So im still in a miserable holding pattern.
My wife is really sick too. But with strep this last couole weeks.
I found at home covid tests for $15 locally. I bought 4 of them. Wife and i both tested negative.
Hope you feel better.
The scopes should have ruled out Diverticulitis and a few others, but what about Celiac disease? Have you tried working on an elimination diet?
Been working on it. First 5 weeks they thought it was my diabetes med. Which is mainly why its taken 2 months to diagnose. Monday im going carb/celiac free.
But half the day yesterday and this morning ive been ok. So we will see.
In late January, weekly Omicron deaths exceeded the record high for previous Covid deaths of any variant, including Delta. Omicron symptoms remain generally milder, but it just spreads so much more. When calculated per 1,000 cases, there were nine deaths per 1,000 cases during the Omicron surge compared to 13 deaths per 1,000 cases during the Delta surge and 16 deaths per 1,000 cases during last winter's surge.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e4.htm?s_cid=mm7104e4_w
Quote from: Anianna on February 06, 2022, 11:28:50 PM
In late January, weekly Omicron deaths exceeded the record high for previous Covid deaths of any variant, including Delta. Omicron symptoms remain generally milder, but it just spreads so much more. When calculated per 1,000 cases, there were nine deaths per 1,000 cases during the Omicron surge compared to 13 deaths per 1,000 cases during the Delta surge and 16 deaths per 1,000 cases during last winter's surge.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e4.htm?s_cid=mm7104e4_w
Not sure why, but your quote doesn't match the report's data. And in doing an F3 search of the CDC webpage article I can't find the word exceeded anywhere on the page. If you do an F3 search on the word 'previous', almost every sentence its used in states that Omicron is less or lower than other variants virulence with the exception of transmissibility and hospitalization. But those aren't indicators of severity.
9 per 1000 is lower than the other two data sets so how can it exceed the record high? [9 is less than 13 or 16]
I did find these from the CDC report:
QuoteSUMMARY
Despite Omicron seeing the highest reported numbers of COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations during the pandemic, disease severity indicators, including length of stay, ICU admission, and death, were lower than during previous pandemic peaks.
Quote..and deaths (nine per 1,000 cases [lagged by 3 weeks]) during the Omicron period were lower than those observed during the winter 2020–21 (92, 68, and 16 respectively) and Delta (167, 78, and 13, respectively) periods. Further, among hospitalized COVID-19 patients from 199 U.S. hospitals, the mean length of stay and percentages who were admitted to an ICU, received invasive mechanical ventilation (IMV), and died while in the hospital were lower during the Omicron period than during previous periods. COVID-19 disease severity appears to be lower during the Omicron period than during previous periods of high transmission, likely related to higher vaccination coverage,† which reduces disease severity (4), lower virulence of the Omicron variant (3,5,6), and infection-acquired immunity (3,7).
Quote from: MacWa77ace on February 07, 2022, 09:39:26 AM
Quote from: Anianna on February 06, 2022, 11:28:50 PM
In late January, weekly Omicron deaths exceeded the record high for previous Covid deaths of any variant, including Delta. Omicron symptoms remain generally milder, but it just spreads so much more. When calculated per 1,000 cases, there were nine deaths per 1,000 cases during the Omicron surge compared to 13 deaths per 1,000 cases during the Delta surge and 16 deaths per 1,000 cases during last winter's surge.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7104e4.htm?s_cid=mm7104e4_w
Not sure why, but your quote doesn't match the report's data. And in doing an F3 search of the CDC webpage article I can't find the word exceeded anywhere on the page. If you do an F3 search on the word 'previous', almost every sentence its used in states that Omicron is less or lower than other variants virulence with the exception of transmissibility and hospitalization. But those aren't indicators of severity.
9 per 1000 is lower than the other two data sets so how can it exceed the record high? [9 is less than 13 or 16]
I did find these from the CDC report:
QuoteSUMMARY
Despite Omicron seeing the highest reported numbers of COVID-19 cases and hospitalizations during the pandemic, disease severity indicators, including length of stay, ICU admission, and death, were lower than during previous pandemic peaks.
Quote..and deaths (nine per 1,000 cases [lagged by 3 weeks]) during the Omicron period were lower than those observed during the winter 2020–21 (92, 68, and 16 respectively) and Delta (167, 78, and 13, respectively) periods. Further, among hospitalized COVID-19 patients from 199 U.S. hospitals, the mean length of stay and percentages who were admitted to an ICU, received invasive mechanical ventilation (IMV), and died while in the hospital were lower during the Omicron period than during previous periods. COVID-19 disease severity appears to be lower during the Omicron period than during previous periods of high transmission, likely related to higher vaccination coverage,† which reduces disease severity (4), lower virulence of the Omicron variant (3,5,6), and infection-acquired immunity (3,7).
That's not a direct quote. Allow me to clarify. The total deaths for the week from Covid were more than the total deaths recorded for previous weeks with other strains. More people died of omicron in that one week than died from other variants in other weeks. That part isn't from that study, it was from an article that is behind a paywall, so I didn't include the link. If you compare the highest number of deaths in one week from Delta to the highest number of deaths in one week from Omicron, you see that Omicron had a higher total.
The second part, the 9 per 1,000 from the study, demonstrates that the percentage of deaths compared to cases with Omicron remains low. The death
rate is lower with Omicron, but overall
total deaths are higher because Omicron is so much more infectious. There are only more total deaths because there are so many more cases.
https://youtu.be/tB1ZSa4bHn4
Quote from: flybynight on February 13, 2022, 10:33:34 AM
https://youtu.be/tB1ZSa4bHn4
Thanks. I immediately went to check my supply of turmeric and finding I was well supplied did cursory research on how to make the tea (put in in water/let it steep), how much to use and pros & cons re medications and various health conditions. Looks like none of mine contraindics so a new medical tool.
Am getting multiple sourced reports that COVID is on the rise again:
Scotland, Ireland, England, France, Germany, Belgium, Austria..... I'll put it like this: 53 EU countries- All of UK.
As of this reporting. UK's NIH reported to still be "on its knees".
Examples:
Austria last month 4,000 daily, now 7,000+ daily
Germany last month 30,000, now 105,000
France " " 17,000, now 56,000+
Italy " " 20,000, now 40,000
etc.
Hospitalized and death are also trending up.
Still in discussion are why, what varients, against vaccines in play currently. No consensus that I can locate yet.
Reports of new 'splinter' variants in addition to sub-variants developing independently around globe is getting much chatter in tracking and research areas.
This is new.
Volatility accompanying actual totals due to altered criteria for reporting, rapid test positives not being reported, changes in overall reporting by public health agencies, light cases attributed to something else, and the Typhoid Mary's spreading it without knowing.
The thing is with this under reporting, which sadly the world nations don't have the funds to maintain, you'd expect to see Not as many cases reported. Which suggests these growing reports are just the tip of the iceberg.
Just this past Monday a clinic in Munich Germany had a sudden wave of COVID patients while 30-35% of staff are out sick... with COVID.
We're seeing some of that where I am, workers testing positive, business way low staffed.
Currently it's fiscally unsound to have masking optional.
And again fiscally unsound, the old, underlying conditions, immunocompromised, otherwise poor immune systems taking the hit with expensive hospitalization and/or the expense of funerals.
Had a doc appointment today and ended up with the flu vaccine in one arm and the covid booster in the other. I figure that by tomorrow I'll be unable to use either arm, since I usually end up with really sore injection sites. But at least I should be at least somewhat better protected from both now!
I'd been hearing the same thing about a resurgence in Europe. The warning was that the same thing could possibly happen here in the US as we go into winter this year.
Quote from: EBuff75 on October 13, 2022, 09:38:06 PMHad a doc appointment today and ended up with the flu vaccine in one arm and the covid booster in the other. I figure that by tomorrow I'll be unable to use either arm, since I usually end up with really sore injection sites. But at least I should be at least somewhat better protected from both now!
I did same, flu one shoulder, booster the other. I'm always knocked off my feet for several days, however this time I had no injection site pain and only a few hours low grade fever. 🎉 🎈
Hoping for you the same!
QuoteI'd been hearing the same thing about a resurgence in Europe. The warning was that the same thing could possibly happen here in the US as we go into winter this year.
Saw that too. So far in covid history we've been around a month plus behind UK and just weeks behind EU. They've been our weathervane for what's on its way here, going on three years now.
I'm more relaxed now that the world is in its groove for detection, researching, and medication of it. But I have growing concern re world economies if this workers off sick with it continues. Doesn't seem sustainable to world and local business economics.
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Yesterday the United States extended the COVID-19 pandemic's status as a public health emergency for another 90 days, thereby preserving measures like high payments to hospitals and expanded Medicaid.
The extension was announced by U.S. Health Secretary Xavier Becerra.
I think this was mostly expected. It is flu season and I've heard for a few years they expect this to become a normal seasonal problem.
"It's just another flu" had some truth to it. Unfortunately many people forgot how horrible the flu is and failed to appreciate what having another one around really meant.
I got my flu shot a few weeks ago during my annual checkup. I've never noticed anything from a flu shot, but this time I slept all weekend. I had covid last spring, and the research I've done indicates a booster won't do much for people in my age and health range, so I'm skipping it (for now, new data my change my mind). My doctor seemed to agree.
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on October 14, 2022, 03:27:08 AMWASHINGTON (Reuters) - Yesterday the United States extended the COVID-19 pandemic's status as a public health emergency for another 90 days, thereby preserving measures like high payments to hospitals and expanded Medicaid.
The extension was announced by U.S. Health Secretary Xavier Becerra.
I expect this to get extended a few more times. Once the medical community latches onto a fresh government money teat it's almost impossible to wean them off it.
Well this is interesting, as in that curse 'May you live in interesting times'. Today went to the doctor who like me has had covid multiple times. He's been advising me all throughout this according to my own immune system requirements and today was saying words I was noting to look up the news on coming events I should watch out for. This article sums up the details of his 'Don't let your guard down' because of the possible consequences if I do.
It's an interesting read.
https://www.cbsnews.com/baltimore/news/quick-and-stealthy-scrabble-variants-are-poised-to-drive-a-winter-covid-19-surge/
Here is an excerpt from it.
The updated bivalent booster vaccines and antiviral drugs like Paxlovid are expected to continue to be protective against severe outcomes from Covid-19 infections caused by the new variants.
But the new variants are particularly devastating for millions of Americans who have weakened immune systems. New research suggests that changes in these variants make them impervious to the last lab-created antibodies available to help treat and prevent severe cases of Covid-19, and the US government has run out of money to incentivize the creation of new ones.
Got my winter COVID booster on October 22 :D
Then caught COVID on Nov 02 :(
I was due to get my flu shot on Nov 05 but had to miss it due to being full of COVID :'(
Apart for that, everything's going just fine ...
Apart from that... 😐
Anyway, how are you all now?
Theyyyy're baaack. 😞 😷 XBB.1.5, omicron sub variant
covid cooties now have a foothold of pandemic infestation in the building. Known confirmed by at least three doctors.
At first it was just one, now new cases are popping up. At least two tenants are being hit hard by it.
Two friends of one of the reporting tenants hadn't seen or heard from him, no answering his phone or door. They checked the hospital. Nope. So called the authorities for an apartment check just in case.
He is there, just ill. Don't know how that played out though.
Quote from: Ever (Zombiepreparation) on January 06, 2023, 09:55:00 PMTheyyyy're baaack. 😞 😷 XBB.1.5, omicron sub variant
covid cooties now have a foothold of pandemic infestation in the building. Known confirmed by at least three doctors.
At first it was just one, now new cases are popping up. At least two tenants are being hit hard by it.
Two friends of one of the reporting tenants hadn't seen or heard from him, no answering his phone or door. They checked the hospital. Nope. So called the authorities for an apartment check just in case.
He is there, just ill. Don't know how that played out though.
Sounds like it played out exactly the way the system is supposed to work. Health & welfare checks are a regular duty of police and other first responders.
True enough from that direction for sure. Didn't think of that myself. Thanks. Good info to know!
Although I was only thinking of how the tenant's illness was playing out.
XBB.1.5 is now the dominant variant in the Northeast. As usual, more transmissable that the last COVID flavor of the month, but no more virulent. Early indications are that while the vaccine and boosters aren't tailored to XBB.1.5, they continue to provide good protection against serious illness and hospitalization.
I too am vaxxed and boosted. I also got the flu shot, as I do every fall. COVID isn't going away so I'm planning on getting an annual flu and COVID booster for the rest of my life.
There is real concern this new Omicron variant could trigger a new surge in the Northeast however. I've noticed a slight uptick in mask usage. But most people, myself included, are going maskless. I was a committed mask wearer for 2+ years but l'll admit it - this pandemic has worn me down. I'll mask up if I get COVID or things start getting truly bad again. But as of now I just want to get on with my life.
I'm with Ever - wine helps. A lot.
https://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2024/06/07/22-55908.pdf (https://cdn.ca9.uscourts.gov/datastore/opinions/2024/06/07/22-55908.pdf)
No comment -- this borders on political as it is.
TL/DR : 9th Circuit Appeals court has held that since vaccine does not prevent you getting covid; the shot is a medical procedure, and there fore persons may refuse such
https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=251466 (https://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=251466)
Quote from: majorhavoc on January 10, 2023, 09:30:25 AMXBB.1.5 is now the dominant variant in the Northeast. As usual, more transmissable that the last COVID flavor of the month, but no more virulent. Early indications are that while the vaccine and boosters aren't tailored to XBB.1.5, they continue to provide good protection against serious illness and hospitalization.
I too am vaxxed and boosted. I also got the flu shot, as I do every fall. COVID isn't going away so I'm planning on getting an annual flu and COVID booster for the rest of my life.
There is real concern this new Omicron variant could trigger a new surge in the Northeast however. I've noticed a slight uptick in mask usage. But most people, myself included, are going maskless. I was a committed mask wearer for 2+ years but l'll admit it - this pandemic has worn me down. I'll mask up if I get COVID or things start getting truly bad again. But as of now I just want to get on with my life.
I'm with Ever - wine helps. A lot.
Watching News videos, can't help but notice a lot of criminal activity enabled with the acceptance of still wearing surgical style cloth masks. At this point , when I observe someone wearing a mask . I consider them to be one of the following.
(A) Criminal attempting to hide their facial features to commit a crime.
(B) Mentally unwell .
(C) actually sick with Covid
I actively avoid all three classes of people
There is another class of people. Those who are wearing N-95 masks( correctly ). Those are mostly people with immune deficiencies . I avoid them out of respect of their plight and they have my sympathies and prayers .
I still see people driving alone in their car wearing a mask.
I just figure:
(B) Mental
(D) Not from Florida
NGL, I had almost no asthma symptoms while we were all wearing masks. That and Dad having cancer were a good reason why I kept wearing mine through 2023. Now I'm having to see a specialist for asthma problems for the first time in ages.
<raising hand> Oo oo! Immune system here!
I read something recently about new COVID mutations a new booster shot coming out this fall. Supposedly the recommendation will be anyone 6 months or older should get it.
This is probably going to be like the flu shot - I'll be getting annual COVID boosters for the rest of my life.
Guess it's time to stop complaining about having to take my shoes off at the airport.
Shoes off; masks on, I wish they would make up their minds which ends we're supposed to keep covered.
We're still doing the middle, right?
Quote from: NT2C on June 28, 2024, 01:50:34 PMWe're still doing the middle right!!!
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-vZdXApzuiZc%2FUjjfV7LwvNI%2FAAAAAAAAA9E%2FRVQkb0Cez9s%2Fs1600%2FPaul-Cram-Underwear.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=f63effd5d9ba55934ecd2de7a91fa040eead0be3ff44ed6c966beeb6df5cb24a&ipo=images)
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Quote from: MacWa77ace on June 28, 2024, 01:55:20 PMQuote from: NT2C on June 28, 2024, 01:50:34 PMWe're still doing the middle right!!!
(https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F-vZdXApzuiZc%2FUjjfV7LwvNI%2FAAAAAAAAA9E%2FRVQkb0Cez9s%2Fs1600%2FPaul-Cram-Underwear.jpg&f=1&nofb=1&ipt=f63effd5d9ba55934ecd2de7a91fa040eead0be3ff44ed6c966beeb6df5cb24a&ipo=images)
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New live action Quail Man movie looks tight.