Simply moving my content from the old ZS site over here, obviously I couldn't move every response so its just my content and whatever quoted question I happened to be answering. Enjoy!
Original thread here:
https://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=102898&hilit=ILBE (https://www.zombiehunters.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=102898&hilit=ILBE)
12/3/2012:
I've been a big proponent of the USMC ILBE pack. whatever the gripes real grunts have with it (not working well with body armor, losing stuff at the bottom ect.) don't really apply to me. getting a civilian style pack at surplus prices is a great deal for me. I've bought 3 in fact.
but I will be the first to admit that ILBEs are HEAVY. like kifaru heavy, but without the durability or awesome features that make the weight worth it. also they went a little overboard on the straps, four compression straps per side? I guess I've never packed mortars around so I don't get to criticize.
Awhile ago I embarked on a mission to lighten the ILBE. I had one sitting around I only paid $30 some odd dollars so I wasn't afraid to cut it up a little. here is a pic of the stock ilbe for reference:
(https://i.imgur.com/lLKdoNv.jpg)
I circled some of the bits that are easy to overlook, buckles for attaching the assault pack (I never got around to buying one and sure wouldn't want to mount it that far from my back), side grab handles, and the diaper-flap/ beaver tail thingy rolled up under the upper molle panel. also if you've never checked out an ILBE in person you might not know that all the zipper pulls have chunks of hose around them to make them easy to grab with gloves or mitts. not a bad feature, but heavy.
ok, lets start at the bottom:
(https://i.imgur.com/9CW97bs.jpg)
most people are afraid to permanently attack their gear, but if you want to drop weight you have to be decisive. I cut off all the molle on the bottom panel and took out the tri-glides holding the buckles on (the stock pic I showed you is a newer one without these) and sewed a loop. I also chopped off the beaver tail flap, I used it occasionally but I decided it could be replaced with a little shock-cord on the upper molle panel. you can also see on the right side were I chopped off the assault pack mounting points.
(https://i.imgur.com/2549vyc.jpg)
moving up I removed the top lid straps and the snap to hold the beaver tail. I also removed all the buckles and straps that the beaver tail mounted too (3 total). removing the top lid is one of the oldest tricks in the book for shedding weight, especially true when you have a lid as heavy as the ILBE!
(https://i.imgur.com/FUrrs1Y.jpg)
the sides are were most of the magic happened. you can see I removed the dumb little half-compression strap off the bottom. I was tempted to delete the middle one too, but some things I mount on the side don't quite reach the top strap. I also replaced the top ladder-lock with a quick-release for convenience.
all that molle you see on the side of the stock ILBE is actually on a separate panel that makes a kind of slot-channel that I never used at all as it was narrow and robbed interior volume if you used it. I also never mounted pouches on the side because it interfered with lashing things on the side.
you probably can't see it but I also removed the tubing from the zipper pulls.
(https://i.imgur.com/omLgSFW.jpg)
you might also notice those coyote panels on the stock ILBE, those are rugged hypalon/rubberized-nylon reinforcements. look cool and make you feel like your pack is tougher but I decided 1000d cordura is plenty tough for anything I dish out.
(https://i.imgur.com/TgLtpps.jpg)
hard to see but the only mods I did to the back panel was to delete the top lid mounting buckles and the side grab handles. I experimented with removing the frame sheet but the lumbar pad and straps don't mount well without it. I'd like to experiment with a lighter hip belt as I don't find the ILBE belt very comfortable anyway (I'm too bony).
(https://i.imgur.com/R6oRpDj.jpg)
Inside: take out any radio pouches, dividers, buckles and straps. once you have a slick tube all the way down you will thank me. do any organizing with light weight stuff sacks or dry bags.
(https://i.imgur.com/BISl7ru.jpg)
you might have wondered why I left the top molle, but I have actually used it. it is the right size for a sustainment pouch which is one of the only molle pouches I think has enough volume to warrant the weight. these are a handy size for raingear, tarps or a cook kit.
I'm debating cutting out all but the outermost channel though, we'll just wait and see.
you can also see were I cut out the top assault pack buckles.
so what is the final result?
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2Fcompressed.jpg&hash=cf2043b906ba2715ec7ebd28d1167d1afb11b1bd)
at the end of the day you still have a 1000d sack, so it's not gonna compete with true lightweight packs but it's a step in the right direction.
even without the weight savings I think the pack is much more usable and less awkward without all the extra strap and buckles. If it wasn't so much work I'd consider sewing the zipper cover down and cutting out both zippers. they are quite heavy and I never use them anyway.
next I might cut out the storm collar and replace it with a lighter sil-nylon.
I don't have a good enough scale to get a solid number on weight savings but I'm pretty sure it can be measured in pounds and not ounces. I'll try to get at least a close estimation by the end of the week. sorry for all the build-up with no data...
*UPDATE* crappy spring-scale is in the mail. should have numbers soon.
so anyway, fear not, all of this was done with scissors, a seam ripper and repair buckles, anyone can do this at home. well worth it. don't be afraid to make your gear your own.
9/9/2013:
finally got rid of the awful black drawstring closure. tried a lighter weight (1.9oz?) coyote closure but the drawstring kept binding up and not sealing well. cut that out when I finally sourced some MARPAT cordura, added a 330d roll-top closure:
(https://i.imgur.com/gPfuXwF.jpg)
adds some serious winter BOB or INCH overstuff potential, I couldn't even get the original over-the-top strap to buckle.
(https://i.imgur.com/G1fKV6D.jpg)
probably approaching the capacity of a Bora 80.
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_6001_zps6eba7bf6.jpg&hash=72253a35b3fb411a6566fcba8753ca82ea5b7757)
trying out a kifaru duplex hip belt on the ILBE, FULL OF WIN. I think I will buy a second belt so I can put this back on my hauler frame.
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_6003_zps5a7c2091.jpg&hash=fac9c02373470b9d6044ba35be9f76de22dea777)
Normal/reasonable BOB size above. nice and short for going through thick vegetation. I like that you can actually see the bulk of the camouflage on the pack now that most of the molle hypalon and packcloth has been removed. Looks a little like the AOR2 Mystery ranch packs I see on ebay for $600 a pop. might hit the coyote straps with some krylon to break them up a little.
all that left to do is shorten the straps (always the hardest part for me) and get a final, more accurate weigh-in.
9/27/2013
Little update, the ILBE experiment continues.
went walking in a steady drizzle, rolltop seems to have adequate water resistance, I used 330d cordura so it's pretty thin and the coating wasn't as noticeable but so far so good.
been playing with belt options, this week it's a kifaru omni-belt:
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_6114_zps12ad42e0.jpg&hash=575363450675b973e2795ffc0c5dbb15cc8ef9b7)
not as nice as the duplex hipbelt, but possibly better for me then the ILBE belt. Have to dig up my bora belt tomorrow before I can report on any weight savings.
the upper tensioner strap on the belt is quite nice though, I didn't connect it on the duplex but it really does suck the pack into your back. I used the loop from one of the compression straps I cut off, fortunately I left the tail.
I have a Hill People Gear prairie belt in the mail, so that will be the next test.
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_6115_zps43d3a2f0.jpg&hash=b2015619b839291b6d2f03dafba0230b03583b0d)
1/11/2014
New ILBE variant, courtesy of Ccombs on the Hill People Gear forums:
http://www.hillpeoplegear.com/Forum/tabid/679/forumid/22/threadid/8808/scope/posts/Default.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
pics reposted with permission:
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2Fimage2_zps465925e5.jpg&hash=2d1342991e94534dbdc52feb30ba04d01d014f30)
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2Fimage_zpsde637b1d.jpg&hash=d877865474db2d0fbab3633ea9899c77ed4150ca)
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2Fimage1_zps3b4998dd.jpg&hash=632adbeb97976fb7dd6317a33e020d94f9d03d5c)
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2Fimage4_zpsf629a452.jpg&hash=acbc971b18ad12796fe83d0efdc6eeaec3a75447)
ILBE hauler frame with cargo panel! I'm personally looking for ILBE number 4 so I can try this myself. coupled with the USMC sealline ILBE liner this could be a pretty slick dry bag hauler. ILBE+kifaru belt can still cost under $100, and this would get you pretty close to the performance of a 24" duplex frame with a cargo panel ($400+?). Alternatively you could chop it all the way off and have the cheapest internal/external hybrid pack frame in history. With some reinforcement along the top edge I bet a cookie this would mate with ALICE/FILBE/Mystery ranch NICE pack bags.
can't believe I didn't think of this!
This is a fantastic thread. I read the one on the ZS forum a number of times. Quality stuff right here.
2/7/2015
The PITA of going from the kifaru belt to the HPG belt is that they are enough different that you really have to re-bend the stays to get maximum potential out of each.
just weighed my ILBE again, down to 5lbs 10oz with HPG harness and belt.
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_9515_zpso2q7oamp.jpg&hash=893c65ed0f504bceea1c3d58a5f421db16ea3cde)
I removed the frame sheet and cut off those fiberglass rods that go from the frame stays to the bottom corners of the bag. I had to relocate the ladderlocks that cinch in the waistbelt to get a more appropriate angle for the kifaru/hpg belts. This set up uses the corners of the bag to wrap around the belt and transfer weight just with tension and proper loading of the pack. It's a little more finicky but I think the end result is more comfortable.
I mounted upper and lower belt tensioners using repair ladderlocks and HPG g-hook straps, I mounted the HPG harness by running straps up from the velcro belt retention straps.
(https://ufozs.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi803.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fyy317%2Flucasbfowler%2FZS%2FIMG_9512_zpsiq020wtb.jpg&hash=53bf9e4b8dda22fec56cc03b4ca475b217a95806)
I am THIS close to chopping off the backpanel foam all together, my back doesn't really make much contact with it anyway. I have also decided that the lumbar pad is way too thick for me but I hesitate to hack it off just yet. If I do I'll just add a thin flap with a single piece of camp mat.
1/31/2016
2016 update:
I'll admit I haven't used the ILBE much in the last year, I quite simply have too many packs I play with and building packs from scratch is actually easier then extensively modifying prebuilt packs.
I do try to pull it out periodically and see what new perspectives I have on the ILBE, but the only one worth mentioning comes from Kifaru's recent pack changes:
As some may have noticed Kifaru has been changing their product line quite a bit recently, the torch there seems to have been firmly passed to Aaron who is primarily hunting focused. To get a leg up in the Hunting Frame Weight Wars they introduced a fairly clever concept with their re-vamped Duplex frame: Carbon arrow shafts as frame stays.
After a lot of head scratching over why I had never heard of anyone trying it before, I went down to Sportsman's Warehouse and bought two 26" carbon arrows ($10) and threw them in my old gen-1 duplex. It isn't an ideal frame, and has some drawbacks but it certainly works for lower weights.
Pros:
A) Tons of flex. if you like freedom of movement with lighter loads this will give you that.
B) Light. a pair of 26" carbon arrows weighs 1oz
3) Cheap. $10
Cons:
1) Tons of flex. while fairly vertically rigid, compressing a load and hitting the load lifters will introduce competing tension that will try to deform the frame. must be managed intelligently.
2) weak. Carbon arrows are tough, but you can break them. I think kifaru recommends using two arrows per stay channel. At lower weights single arrows don't worry me.
C) flat. No complex curves like aluminum stays, if you have a particularly curvy back this might not be for you. I think perfect frame curve is overrated but it is certainly preferable.
So as far as weight savings for the ILBE, the stock 7075 aluminum stays weigh about 9oz. the carbon arrows weight 1oz, this means a wopping half pound weight savings, or just under if you double up on arrows. the problem is that 26" seems the shortest I can find arrows so 2" needs to be trimmed off, something I haven't done yet because I hate cutting carbon (possible advantage: leaving the arrows at 24.5" or 25" to sneak a little more frame height in). What I have done is mocked up my ILBE with HPG suspension and weighed it and it seems I have hit the 5lb mark! I fully expect the bulk of ILBE readers to turn their noses up at the idea of a carbon frame because after all the bulk of ILBE users see no problem with a 9lb backpack to begin with. But for those users that expect to stay under, say, 40lbs I think this is a viable option for them to explore.
When I do get some more arrows and finally get around to trimming them down I will post some pictures. Anyone that wants to read feedback on using carbon arrows in the Duplex frames can go over to the Rokslide forums.
I also plan to get a third (fourth?) ILBE and do some less extreme lighting mods on it so that I can go all-out on my first tester and give better advice on how far is too far with the ILBE.
3/7/2018
Tried to repost some of the old pictures in the original posts, got many but not all.
2018 update:
(https://i.imgur.com/aLM7FVs.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/5ShuSx1.jpg)
finally took the needed leap to chop off the backpanel padding and the harness mounting velcro under it, saved 3 oz:
(https://i.imgur.com/dWFIHdG.jpg)
also replaced the stock lumbar pad I've never been fond of, went with a HPG style simple cordura sleeve that I can add and remove foam to taste. netted me another 2 oz:
(https://i.imgur.com/uy3ydIe.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/rnIezOg.jpg)
One of the more technical mods, I removed one of the large side access zippers and sewed the zipper flap down to cover the hole. I'm tempted to remove the other one as well since I almost never used them, but I can always do that later. Saves 2oz per zipper:
(https://i.imgur.com/n4c5xeG.jpg)
Went in and unstitched a few of the spots around the pack that I had lazily just chopped off and left stubs, probably picked up another oz overall:
(https://i.imgur.com/T8DF67H.jpg)
I ripped out the old roll top and spruced it up a bit with a better stiffening ring and buckles, also tore out the last remnants of the old black drawstring closure that had been connecting the rolltop to the cordura body. I'm glad I never got around to trimming the compression straps, found out they are long enough to hook up a pretty sweet HPG Ute style pulley compression system; extra compression as well as easier external hauling on the front of the pack:
(https://i.imgur.com/ypix69f.jpg)
you may also notice I made the lower front lashing straps removable, I just cut them off leaving enough webbing to sew on a metal 3-bar slider to add them back on when needed. I also stole one of the straps I cut off elsewhere to build a much longer over-the-top strap to accommodate the extra capacity of the rolltop.
(https://i.imgur.com/NXvxHqr.jpg)
A view of the new lumbar pad with a rare shot of The_Alias' kilted leg:
(https://i.imgur.com/w3njUoo.jpg)
Final weight as it sits now with HPG harness and belt and bamboo frame stays (don't ask) is 4lbs 9oz. Using carbon arrows will drop a few more oz, and using the stock aluminum ones will add several back on. Removing the pack padding and using taller stays together improve the load handling quite a lot, despite weighing half as much as the issued pack it is more comfortable and gives up almost nothing on load hauling or durability.
(https://i.imgur.com/ET8mNlB.jpg?1)
If you were willing to trim off the bottle pockets, the second zipper and go down to 4 compression straps you could easily get under 4lbs with carbon arrow frame stays, putting it in a very small club of lightweight huge capacity packs.
2021 update:
(https://i.imgur.com/LhDhvMK.jpg)
Haven't gotten up to much, been playing with a lot of other packs but I finally chopped the bottle pockets off for nearly a 4oz savings; more than I would have guessed. At this point my ILBE is just a roll top tube with a single side zip and a fairly extensive compression system.
I've fallen into a large amount of hipbelts at work I'm going to try and modify for ILBE use. I think the days of cheap ILBE bags are behind us largely so this thread isn't as useful to the masses as it used to be, I no longer recommend the ILBE most of the time due to the raising prices despite it still being a solid pack. I hope this thread still helps a good number of people that bought in during the golden age but I suspect the FILBE will be around much longer and remain cheaper than this pack.
Me thinks me needs this kinda rig, as the current pack is not cutting it.