Billionaires Bunker Mistakes?

[Lambykins]

Okay...hear me out here.
We have all seen or read reports of the mega-rich building bunkers in Hawaii, New Zealand, etc.Millions and millions of dollars to produce luxurious self-sustaining enclaves intended to save their elite @sses *in the event* of widespread natural or manmade disaster.
Even the "semi-rich" invest copious amounts of their money into "time share" type bunkers in old missile silos in the midwest.
I've seen the same reports...and I think the majority of them are making huge mistakes, mainly in choosing their locations.
Take Zuck as an example:
His reportedly 270 million dollar bunker is being constructed in Hawaii.
So, let's see...huge construction, on an island, in an area known to be part of the "Ring of Fire". An island that has experienced tsunamis, volcanos and some earthquakes and close to a large military installation.
Same goes for those mega rich guys building on New Zealand.
The stability of these locations is very questionable to me.
Add in populations that openly resent these guys coming in and raising property prices doing this PLUS aboriginal/native populations that in the event of said disasters would band together (most likely) against the mega rich AND the mainly European derived populations that they may feel have encroached upon their lands.
Personally, I wouldn't want to be on the bad side of the Maoris in said situation, but that's just me.

Now, onto the midwest and those luxury time share bunkers (that's what I call them, anyway).
The US built up it's nuclear stockpile in the 50s and 60s and so did everybody else. The basic premise was that everyone would target everyone else's military targets. What's a missile silo? A military target.
Also, the decommissioning of said silos does not mean they are taken off the target list. Military bureaucracy being what it is, retargeting of major military assets can require many meetings, voting by various political entities, input from ever-changing military commanders and strategists, and on and on. Also, many of said weapons are now aging and retargeting can be difficult and sometimes nigh near impossible. In some cases I think most of us could relate to some guy in the Politbureau shrugging his shoulders and saying "Eh, just leave it, we'll build a new one for the new target, it'll be cheaper".
So, accordingly, if you think one of these bunkers would be safe from a direct hit, think again. They were built to resist a hit from a nuclear weapon from the 1950s-1970s. Also, most of those missiles were not as accurate as missiles now. Some yields are lower, to be sure, but some are way higher (see Tsar Bomba).

Everytime I see one of those reports about billionaire bunkers, I shake my head.

Also, Zuck and some of the other uber rich are requiring all members of their construction crews to sign NDAs. So....in the event of a disaster, Zuck expects all those guys to NOT attempt to save their own butts and those of their family and friends? You absolutely KNOW more than one of those guys is mentally cataloging every weakness or possible *back door*. Construction workers are not idiots, most of those I have met are pretty damn smart. They are used to solving problems *on the fly* and can frequently resolve very complex issues in a short period of time. Don't rule out the ingenuity of the average construction worker.

What are your thoughts?
If you were one of these billionaires, where would you head to?

[Moab]

Zuck has an Asian wife. Japanese? Maybe they get a pass from the locals? But I doubt it. The natives there are born of centuries of fighting each other and outsiders. I agree. He will be the first place they raid. Or destroy.

As to location:

I don't think foreign powers are geniuses. But they aren't stupid. It's public common knowledge those Midwest bunkers are noncommissioned. I don't think they will waste nukes on them - first. But they have hundreds, thousands? Of nukes. But it seems like there are more than enough population centers to waste their extras on. Not only would they not reach the depth of those bunkers. No one lives there. They might as well shoot into the middle of the most remote desert in the US.

I think they have this misconception that they will be living out their lives underground. Like some Star Trek Enterprise fantasy. If they chose well they could return to the surface. And eventually they or their kids will have that opportunity. The surface of the middle of nowhere in the Midwest is pretty bleak.

I would try for a more wooded, nature rich environment. As far away from targets as possible. I do not know where that is. But I'm thinking the open west. To much population in the east. MT, WY, UT? 

WY is so open and cheap. And nature rich. I wonder if many of those recent rich guy, huge ranch acquisitions have this in mind. I wonder how many of them quietly built bunkers? (And why are all these rich idiots making this all publicized?!) Wouldn't it be possible to buy a ranch or huge piece of property clandestinely? And have a bunker built for an unknown source? At least people wouldn't have the added attraction of knowing a Bill Gates lives there or whoever. But still if you can afford a 200 million dollar bunker you know the entity is Uber rich, has installed everything you need, and stocked it with years of supplies. I'm not sure anyone that builds something like that is safe. All the hundreds of people that worked on it and delivered equipment and supplies knows about it.

I don't understand the build safeguards. But these have to have air vents. Someone will eventually figure out how to blow those apart, get into them or just destroy their access to air. With all the time in the world. And access to explosives, equipment and people with that knowledge it will eventually happen.

I think the failure might be in the size and cost. If you quietly built something average sized in a nondescript piece of property, better places in nature, you might stand a better chance of surviving long term. Maybe some false bunkers? And something else hidden near by? Idk. Just seems like there is a better location and more discrete way of going about it. I wonder if they plan for housing a group of guards and their families? Or some other professionals they made need? A doctor maybe?

What kind of defenses do these have? Are there remote defense bunkers that keep passerbys away? I can't believe there aren't some form of outside defense? And that it's just not a concrete block with an air vent out the top?

What if Zucks actual bunker is tucked away in a small ravine in WY? And the whole HI thing is just a ruse? Maybe his main bunker is connected underground to a series of protected other bunkers? Like a series of fall backs that are harder to get into because the extra security entrances are so far underground? 

I guess you still need to have air. That's the secret. How do you get air without anyone finding that entrance or not being able to breach it? 

[Lambykins]

I know the Walton family (of Walmart fame) has built a large enclave with supposedly a large well-appointed bunker.
Their construction workers also had to sign NDAs according to stories going around at the time and they have very well-armed guards on the property.This is in Arkansas.

Here's the other problem with those midwest bunkers. Sure, they are decommissioned, BUT there are many silo sites left that are NOT decommissioned.Nebraska, Idaho, Wyoming, etc all have them.

I suspect that Ted Turner built a good sized bunker on his western property. There are loads of the *old guard* rich elite crew that own massive properties in Montana, Colorado, Wyoming and Utah. Some quietly bought up large parcels in the Dakotas.This was 20 to 30 years ago. I'm sure they have kept their bunkers updated, but once you have the basic infrastructure, updating it is not too pricey, I guess.

I agree that it would be best to look for a bunker location off the beaten path with plenty of natural resources.
But these dummies are building in some of the worst natural disaster zones on the planet!
The Ring of Fire? Really? REALLY? Earthquake zones? (I'm looking at you, Bill Gates) Tsunami danger areas?
Near major military assets? Who the hell was advising them?

[wolf_from_wv]

If we know about the bunker, did the NDA work?

[TACAIR]

Where would I head?

Hill Country TX.

More than a few natural caves in the area.

Those, I would think, would make a nice 'root cellars" or 'wine storage space'.

At least the climate is not quickly lethal.

[Moab]

Where would I head?

Hill Country TX.

More than a few natural caves in the area.

Those, I would think, would make a nice 'root cellars" or 'wine storage space'.

At least the climate is not quickly lethal.

I've always been fascinated by caves. My grandfather new if a few in the mountains outside our tiny PNW logging town. He showed me where he marked them in his maps. I inherited his maps when he died. But never found the map with the cave markings. 

What a valuable piece of information - lost. These were way out in the middle of the woods too. Very difficult to find. He spent over 60 yrs climbing thru the mountains. Hunting. Working. Building trails for the USFS. Studying mountain goats. So many questions I wish I'd have asked. But didn't. It's always like that huh? 

[MacWa77ace]

They may be planning for an ELE [Deep Impact, Greenland, Armageddon type of advanced notice event].

In the event of a cosmic collision with years warning, it could work, as long as the impact isn't in that quarter of the sphere. e.g.: northern hemisphere / eastern hemisphere like the Tunguska event. [but 100 times the size]



But the mistake i see is in those remote locations; you need to get to them. So any type of Nuke, or EMP, alien attack, or cosmic radiation event [quick] they won't be able to get to their Billionaire bunkers in time. This goes for any remote BOL, Billionaire to Pauper, if you can't get to it under any circumstances, its useless.

I'm sure they would take their staff [aka PAW slaves] to do their laundry and all the other demeaning chores they shun today, so in the event of a #plandemic, that wouldn't work, nature finds a way.

If they have time to get to their site. I wouldn't be worried about any 'normal'  natural disasters or nuclear targeting of converted silo bunkers. It'd be like getting to the bunker to hide from a comet impact but it lands right on top of you. 

Wattayagonnadoo.

[Raptor]

If we know about the bunker, did the NDA work?

NDA are common with household staff of the 1%+/-. NDA in most states generally have to expire (unless trade secrets are involved). ...and yes they are about worth the paper they are written upon especially after 3 years.

Zucky has enough $$$ that he can spend $250 million on many bunkers.

But everyone hit the nail on the head if you are not liked by your neighbors if & when TSHTF you are going to need a group of security people who like you or they will simply turn you over to the mob...of join the mob. It is very difficult for high profile people (especially ass hats) to find a low key place that can be secure. They are better off using the bunker story as cover for a real intended hidey hole.
   

 

[Moab]

If we know about the bunker, did the NDA work?

NDA are common with household staff of the 1%+/-. NDA in most states generally have to expire (unless trade secrets are involved). ...and yes they are about worth the paper they are written upon especially after 3 years.

Zucky has enough $$$ that he can spend $250 million on many bunkers.

But everyone hit the nail on the head if you are not liked by your neighbors if & when TSHTF you are going to need a group of security people who like you or they will simply turn you over to the mob...of join the mob. It is very difficult for high profile people (especially ass hats) to find a low key place that can be secure. They are better off using the bunker story as cover for a real intended hidey hole.
 

 

The team of SOF guys he has hired as security will be running the place and his wife within a couple days. No question. (Pardon my graphic comment. It's more about the abilities and ruthlessness of guys with that kind of demeanor and experience. They know what's up. Have been in that situation before. Or similar enough. I wonder what Zucks attorneys have hypothesized about this very scenario? Interesting concept to overcome. Having a hard time imagining what if anything he could offer at that point to keep them loyal. He's such an annoying dweeb on top of it. I don't see them putting up with him for very long. Could you imagine him giving them orders? Lol!) Once inside he has nothing to offer them for them to remain loyal. If the world ends. 

I think SOF will run the world after a true SHTF event. Who's going to oppose them? I can see different factions of the Seals, Green Beret's, CIA combat personnel etc fighting one another. Or at the very least controlling large areas. And keeping a healthy distance. 

They've taken over, trained and led small nations and their armies. Not much difference between that and a post apocalyptic world.

[Lambykins]

Still, I find it ludicrous that these people are building their bug-out bunkers in some of the most geographically precarious locations on the planet.
Tsunami zones---check!
Earthquake zone---check!
Volcanic zone---check!
Close to high value military targets?---check!
Who the hell is advising them to put their bunkers in these locations?
Real estate agents?

Back to NDAs...
The publicity around these bunkers effectively renders those NDAs null and void, more or less.
Everyone now knows where they are and who is going to be there. Families/friends of the workers may not know details, but just knowing generalities is a problem for the bunker owners.
Also, some of those midwest bunkers post their plans on line with schematics. Whose bright idea was that? /sarcasm

As far as security forces...
Yeah, that's a HUGE issue. Because of...everything. Family, loyalty, greed, morals, etc.
People are gonna people.
I've known military people that are more loyal to their unit than their families.
On the other hand, there are many people out there that would immediately betray their bunker billionaire employer rather than endanger one member of their family.
Like I said, people are gonna people. 

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

[TACAIR]

'Bunkers' for rich folks are not new.



didn't work all that well back then.

[Moab]

'Bunkers' for rich folks are not new.



didn't work all that well back then.

Lmao! So true!

[Raptor]

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

A lot depends on the SHTF situation.

If it is severe the only hidey hole is in a another country not having the issues.
For instance the Romanov dynasty had castles, loyal retainers, etc. They still wound up dead with the dynastic line extinct.

If it is an EOTHWKI global type event they actually may be better off than the others, but in the long run it will depend upon the comprehensiveness of their pre-planning.

IMO the best plan for other SHTF events (if you find your self in the 1%) is a Gulfstream 800 and 3 pilots never more than an hour away. 

I always thought the best bug out location was to own a boutique hotel in Switzerland with part of the top floors being residential. The Swiss are business friendly, require NBC shelters in all new builds and are prepared to wait out everyone. https://www.newlyswissed.com/switzerland-fallout-shelters/
You just have to get there...hence the Gulfstream 800 it can fly around the world with 3 fuel stops and  anyplace in world from anyplace in the world is within its range with one fuel stop.

Iceland or Greenland would be my next choice.

Obviously YMMV.

[Moab]

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

A lot depends on the SHTF situation.

If it is severe the only hidey hole is in a another country not having the issues.
For instance the Romanov dynasty had castles, loyal retainers, etc. They still wound up dead with the dynastic line extinct.

If it is an EOTHWKI global type event they actually may be better off than the others, but in the long run it will depend upon the comprehensiveness of their pre-planning.

IMO the best plan for other SHTF events (if you find your self in the 1%) is a Gulfstream 800 and 3 pilots never more than an hour away. 

I always thought the best bug out location was to own a boutique hotel in Switzerland with part of the top floors being residential. The Swiss are business friendly, require NBC shelters in all new builds and are prepared to wait out everyone. https://www.newlyswissed.com/switzerland-fallout-shelters/
You just have to get there...hence the Gulfstream 800 it can fly around the world with 3 fuel stops and  anyplace in world from anyplace in the world is within its range with one fuel stop.

Iceland or Greenland would be my next choice.

Obviously YMMV.

I almost mentioned Switzerland as well. It is one of the most defendable countries on earth. They did not get invaded during WWII. Not because they handled everyone's financial issues. They did not get invaded because it is a rock fortress. Naturally and man made. They still have bunkers all over. In the cliffs. And in random houses. That look like houses but are actually thick concrete bunkers. But the way the country is positioned it's in the middle of high large rock mountains and formations. That make it almost impossible to invade.

[aikorob]

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

A lot depends on the SHTF situation.

If it is severe the only hidey hole is in a another country not having the issues.
For instance the Romanov dynasty had castles, loyal retainers, etc. They still wound up dead with the dynastic line extinct.

If it is an EOTHWKI global type event they actually may be better off than the others, but in the long run it will depend upon the comprehensiveness of their pre-planning.

IMO the best plan for other SHTF events (if you find your self in the 1%) is a Gulfstream 800 and 3 pilots never more than an hour away. 

I always thought the best bug out location was to own a boutique hotel in Switzerland with part of the top floors being residential. The Swiss are business friendly, require NBC shelters in all new builds and are prepared to wait out everyone. https://www.newlyswissed.com/switzerland-fallout-shelters/
You just have to get there...hence the Gulfstream 800 it can fly around the world with 3 fuel stops and  anyplace in world from anyplace in the world is within its range with one fuel stop.

Iceland or Greenland would be my next choice.

Obviously YMMV.

I almost mentioned Switzerland as well. It is one of the most defendable countries on earth. They did not get invaded during WWII. Not because they handled everyone's financial issues. They did not get invaded because it is a rock fortress. Naturally and man made. They still have bunkers all over. In the cliffs. And in random houses. That look like houses but are actually thick concrete bunkers. But the way the country is positioned it's in the middle of high large rock mountains and formations. That make it almost impossible to invade.

not to mention tectonically stable; and a VERY low risk of tsunamis

[Raptor]

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

A lot depends on the SHTF situation.

If it is severe the only hidey hole is in a another country not having the issues.
For instance the Romanov dynasty had castles, loyal retainers, etc. They still wound up dead with the dynastic line extinct.

If it is an EOTHWKI global type event they actually may be better off than the others, but in the long run it will depend upon the comprehensiveness of their pre-planning.

IMO the best plan for other SHTF events (if you find your self in the 1%) is a Gulfstream 800 and 3 pilots never more than an hour away. 

I always thought the best bug out location was to own a boutique hotel in Switzerland with part of the top floors being residential. The Swiss are business friendly, require NBC shelters in all new builds and are prepared to wait out everyone. https://www.newlyswissed.com/switzerland-fallout-shelters/
You just have to get there...hence the Gulfstream 800 it can fly around the world with 3 fuel stops and  anyplace in world from anyplace in the world is within its range with one fuel stop.

Iceland or Greenland would be my next choice.

Obviously YMMV.

I almost mentioned Switzerland as well. It is one of the most defendable countries on earth. They did not get invaded during WWII. Not because they handled everyone's financial issues. They did not get invaded because it is a rock fortress. Naturally and man made. They still have bunkers all over. In the cliffs. And in random houses. That look like houses but are actually thick concrete bunkers. But the way the country is positioned it's in the middle of high large rock mountains and formations. That make it almost impossible to invade.

not to mention tectonically stable; and a VERY low risk of tsunamis

The Swiss use thier geography in many ways to thier benefit. They use hydroelectric power and produce enough that exporting it to neighbors in a quantity that makes it one of its key exported product.

Imo the main reason the Swiss avoid invasions is because there are no real resources there to make occupation worthwhile. If invaded the industry that is valuable will be destroyed and you are left with rocks and a bunch of pissed off Swiss. Better to cut a deal with them and get what you want that way.

Iceland and Greenland are kinda the same. BTW both produce most of their energy  needs with geothermal power.

[echo83]

Still, I find it ludicrous that these people are building their bug-out bunkers in some of the most geographically precarious locations on the planet.
Tsunami zones---check!
Earthquake zone---check!
Volcanic zone---check!
Close to high value military targets?---check!
Who the hell is advising them to put their bunkers in these locations?
Real estate agents?

Back to NDAs...
The publicity around these bunkers effectively renders those NDAs null and void, more or less.
Everyone now knows where they are and who is going to be there. Families/friends of the workers may not know details, but just knowing generalities is a problem for the bunker owners.
Also, some of those midwest bunkers post their plans on line with schematics. Whose bright idea was that? /sarcasm

As far as security forces...
Yeah, that's a HUGE issue. Because of...everything. Family, loyalty, greed, morals, etc.
People are gonna people.
I've known military people that are more loyal to their unit than their families.
On the other hand, there are many people out there that would immediately betray their bunker billionaire employer rather than endanger one member of their family.
Like I said, people are gonna people. 

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

Local population issues may not be an issue where some of these decommissioned silos are located, (sparse population) but take a look at how local populations in some small tourist areas responded during Covid. 

A relative of mine lives on the coast down South, and there were people in his upscale community talking seriously about blocking the bridges onto the island of their community, or manning a small "checkpoint" to keep an eye on who is coming and going.

The idea dried up pretty quickly once: 

1.) Someone pointed out that it would be difficult to differentiate between tourists and tourists who actually owned summer homes there.

2.) People realized that they would eventually have to live with the consequences of their actions towards tourists and neighbors once things returned to normal. Keeping the peace/helping neighbors during a hurricane is one thing, asking "Papers, please" to everyone driving by is another.

There was still a bit of suspicion towards out-of-town plates, though. 

This is how people were behaving before the nukes started flying. 

[Moab]

Still, I find it ludicrous that these people are building their bug-out bunkers in some of the most geographically precarious locations on the planet.
Tsunami zones---check!
Earthquake zone---check!
Volcanic zone---check!
Close to high value military targets?---check!
Who the hell is advising them to put their bunkers in these locations?
Real estate agents?

Back to NDAs...
The publicity around these bunkers effectively renders those NDAs null and void, more or less.
Everyone now knows where they are and who is going to be there. Families/friends of the workers may not know details, but just knowing generalities is a problem for the bunker owners.
Also, some of those midwest bunkers post their plans on line with schematics. Whose bright idea was that? /sarcasm

As far as security forces...
Yeah, that's a HUGE issue. Because of...everything. Family, loyalty, greed, morals, etc.
People are gonna people.
I've known military people that are more loyal to their unit than their families.
On the other hand, there are many people out there that would immediately betray their bunker billionaire employer rather than endanger one member of their family.
Like I said, people are gonna people. 

Local population issues are a big red flag to me. Especially when it is a different culture.
Honestly, in the event of natural/manmade disasters in these locations, I have no problem believing that the native/aboriginal populations would survive. BUT, I also believe they would find a way to *neutralize* the billionaire in the bunker on *their* lands. Maybe the locals couldn't breach the bunker, but I am sure they could find a way to effectively seal the billionaire (and their minions) in the bunkers.

Local population issues may not be an issue where some of these decommissioned silos are located, (sparse population) but take a look at how local populations in some small tourist areas responded during Covid.

A relative of mine lives on the coast down South, and there were people in his upscale community talking seriously about blocking the bridges onto the island of their community, or manning a small "checkpoint" to keep an eye on who is coming and going.

The idea dried up pretty quickly once:

1.) Someone pointed out that it would be difficult to differentiate between tourists and tourists who actually owned summer homes there.

2.) People realized that they would eventually have to live with the consequences of their actions towards tourists and neighbors once things returned to normal. Keeping the peace/helping neighbors during a hurricane is one thing, asking "Papers, please" to everyone driving by is another.

There was still a bit of suspicion towards out-of-town plates, though.

This is how people were behaving before the nukes started flying.

That type of thing got more serious here during the riots and looting. Groups in Malibu set up checkpoints. But nothing ever became of it.

I here you though. I live in a much worse area for this type of activity. In the likely reality that people would be pushing into our neighborhoods. We live about 1-2 miles from the freeway that separates the "beach communities" from the largest hoods in Los Angeles. Ours is a 2 mile strip of land along the beach. Beyond the freeway the hoods stretch out for 4 hours east. And if there is a LE plan to block access. I doubt many of the LEOs, who just about all live elsewhere, will be showing up or staying for long. We do have the Los Angeles Air Force base between us and the freeway. But I'd feel better if it was any other branch. Lol. Id settle for the National Guard. 

But I think it's funny when a rich community, without a large poor population anywhere near, acts as if aliens are landing and they need to set up road blocks and check IDs. Would they even know how to set one up? Or how to defend it? Lol.