Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel

[Lambykins]

I am having a hard time expressing my thoughts right now, and I am going to try so damn hard not to stray into our forbidden topics (politics and religion) while I write this, so excuse me if it sounds a bit disjointed.

My observations :

The majority of folks are unaware that WW3 has begun. Not with the Hamas attack, but it has low key been going on for a few years now. Smouldering. Hamas just fanned that spark into flame.

Israel is surrounded. It has ALWAYS been surrounded by those who wish it to be eradicated. Reports have already started of mild *probing* attacks happening at its' other borders.

Women and children flee from wars. Young men head into battle. The majority of refugees from the ME heading into Europe, the UK and even the US are not women and children.  They are men of fighting age.

Supporters of Israel are being targeted in the UK (read several articles yesterday about it it) Pro Hamas gatherings have been held in just about every country that has accepted large numbers of those "refugees". There will be incidents Friday 13th. I think it will get bad. Very bad.

If it comes down to it, I think Israel is going to feel that they have no other option to protect their people and nation than to go with the "glass parking lot" solution. I think fingers are slowly yet dangerously getting closer to some very scary buttons.

I live in a heavily armed rural area. I feel safe. I worry a great deal about family and friends that live in cities and areas that the populace is prevented from being armed. I also live in an area that believes in prepping, long term food storage and everything that goes with it. Again, I feel safe and prepared. I am personally not armed, haven't had the money to get a new firearm after having to sell mine a few years ago, HOWEVER I could access a firearm within 10 to 30 minutes. Hell, if shit starts going down, I am pretty sure the PD and local gun store would try to arm as many citizens as possible as fast as possible. I also have open invites to hunker down at differents friends farms, if it comes to that.

I think it was Einstein that said he didn't know what weapons would be used in WW3, but he was pretty sure WW4 would be fought with sticks and stones. I live in The Great North Woods in The Granite State. Sticks and stones are plentiful here.

Again, I believe WW3 has begun. MSM isn't saying it, the politicians aren't saying it, almost no one is saying it. A few people on various platforms like youtube are opining that it has, but most are being quiet about it.
Look at the history of WW2. What year did it start? What event?
It didn't just erupt out of nowhere, full-fledged and screaming. It began long before the first bomber flew over England or the first ship was sunk at Pearl Harbor.

I don't know what can be done to stop this monstrosity from barreling down this path. It scares the crap out of me to see this happening.

The basic inhuman acts that have been committed make me think Israel may be correct if they opt for the "glass parking lot" solution. Can the peoples that have beliefs that allow and even encourage them to commit such horrors ever be accepted as members of the human race? Horrific acts were committed in the name of the German people during WW2. Not ALL Germans were guilty of those acts. But yet, I have so much anger at the generalized people of that ME region. They protected Hamas (and Hezbollah), they supported them. To me, it feels like they ALL conspired with them to commit the atrocities. In anger, I think we all paint with a broad brush.

Solutions? I have none.
Anger and disgust and contempt...I have plenty.

I have noticed here in Lambytown that more of the folks are carrying since the Hamas attacks. Not out of fear, but out of awareness. Awareness of dark possibilities, awareness of the putrid evil that lurks beneath the skin of some people.

My suggestions for those of you living in more urban areas:
Stay away, far away from crowds, festivals, street fairs, concerts, etc.
Carry if you are able in your AO. Open or concealed.
On the 13th especially, stay away from synagogues. If that is your faith, it is sad to say, I fear some will be targeted. Also, if that is your faith, it may be wise to not wear your kippah out in public.
Make sure you have your preps topped off as much as you can.

That's about all I can say without getting into a forbidden discussion on religion, international politics, domestic politics, multiculturalism, diversity, and thinly veiled threats against a population.
I'm just angry and tired.

[Uomo Senza Nome]

Solutions? I have none.
Anger and disgust and contempt...I have plenty.

And pity. My faith demands that I not desire the things my neighbor has. Yet, practically every war ever fought was because someone wanted something that somebody else had or wanted someone to do something that they didn't want to do.

I have yet to lose faith, because I don't want to. People mostly suck, but they often do the right thing, even if they are made to.

"With this faith we will be able to hew out of the mountain of despair a stone of hope."

Houthi in Yemen says they will now throw in with the Hamas. I guess they will all march into the flames hand in hand.

[Raptor]

Lambykins: I believe WW3 has begun.

I am old; old enough to remember the US involvement in Vietnam in the early 1960's and being told by a Korean War Vet basically the same thing about WW-3 having begun.

I can understand your conclusion in this matter and honestly only time will tell if that is the case. The historical similarities to the Japanese incursion into China in the 1930's is similar in some aspects to the Russia/Ukraine conflict.

Solutions? I have none.Anger and disgust and contempt...I have plenty.

And pity.

The acts of Hamas are absolutely barbaric. There is no way acts of terror against civilians can be justified. Feelings of disgust and contempt are reasonable, rational and IMO wide spread except for a few people in the US using for political or personal attention. I will say no more about those people.

I too have a feeling of pity for all of the innocents caught up in this. IMO the military response to this barbaric act by Hamas is quite justifiable. I cannot imagine any solution that does not require the perpetrators to be captured or killed in the process of capture.
Still it means that innocents will suffer as a result. That is not a good outcome. 

A solution is possible only when the parties in a situation want to arrive at a solution. In this case hamas' desire is the total liquidation of Israel. In this case the goals are irreconcilable.

That brings up the other emotion I feel in addition to those above...resignation... to the fact that this will be a nasty and ugly next few months.  Trite quips come to mind like haters gonna hate but that simply belittles the ugliness of this situation (& Russia/Ukraine).

I will suggest that we all stay vigilant and exercise reasonable prudence because IMO another shoe is going to drop, possibly in the US. 

[majorhavoc]

The Samburu of East Africa have a saying: 

When elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers.

[DarkAxel]

Ex-soldier fought off Hamas and saved kibbutz neighbours

BBC News

One of the first Israeli settlements to come under attack when Hamas militants surged into Israel early on Saturday morning was the Nir Am kibbutz, where local people put up a fierce defence and drove the attackers away.
"I took my pistol, my clothes, my bulletproof vest and the other thing was cigarettes," Adam says, calmly recounting being jolted from his bed by the sound of gunfire at 06:30 on Saturday. "We started to kill everyone who came to the fence."
He's been labelled the hero of Nir Am, the saviour of his kibbutz, a community of around 400 people living just 2km (1.2 miles) from Gaza.
"I took the walkie-talkie and I said this line again and again: 'No-one will enter Nir Am, no-one will enter Nir Am.'"
Adam is 46, ex-special-forces, so we can't show his face or use his full name. His head is shaved, a boxer, not the biggest man but you wouldn't mess with him. It's clear he can handle himself.
He was joined by other men from the kibbutz, he says.

"Civilians who don't know how to fight but have got a lot of heart. Two or three with special forces experience but the others... just regular men, they work in IT. Regular men, but very, very special."
Together they fought for between three and five hours - Adam isn't exactly sure. Then came a lull... More at Source Link

Source

[Raptor]

There was a story about another person a 26 year old women who also was at a similar kibbutz and was credited with leading a group of residents who killed 40 terrorists over several hours during repeated assaults.

It goes to show what people with the proper tools Can do.
 https://www.the-sun.com/news/9300866/israel-palestine-hamas-woman-hero-kibbutz-villag

[Uomo Senza Nome]

It goes to show what people with the proper tools Can do.

Defensible position, properly prepared and trained and equipped. I wouldn't live within a mile of the Gaza Strip, but if I had to, it would be like that.

[Lambykins]

Apparently Israel has given Gaza residents 24 hours to evacuate. Notified the UN and NATO and all that.

[majorhavoc]

Apparently Israel has given Gaza residents 24 hours to evacuate. Notified the UN and NATO and all that.

Apparently a prelude to an Israeli incursion into northern Gaza.  We're talking about over a million people being told to relocate to the southern portion of the strip with only 24 hours notice.  With no fuel for transport or even electricity to power lights, let alone traffic controls.  A recipe for utter chaos.  

No judgment about why Israel is doing what it's doing in response to Hamas' horrific, inhuman butchery.  Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic.  

[Lambykins]

Apparently Israel has given Gaza residents 24 hours to evacuate. Notified the UN and NATO and all that.

Apparently a prelude to an Israeli incursion into northern Gaza.  We're talking about over a million people being told to relocate to the southern portion of the strip with only 24 hours notice.  With no fuel for transport or even electricity to power lights, let alone traffic controls.  A recipe for utter chaos. 

No judgment about why Israel is doing what it's doing in response to Hamas' horrific, inhuman butchery.  Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic. 

Hamas has a history and reputation for putting women and children first....as targets. I have no doubt they will refuse to allow anyone to leave.

[majorhavoc]

Apparently Israel has given Gaza residents 24 hours to evacuate. Notified the UN and NATO and all that.

Apparently a prelude to an Israeli incursion into northern Gaza.  We're talking about over a million people being told to relocate to the southern portion of the strip with only 24 hours notice.  With no fuel for transport or even electricity to power lights, let alone traffic controls.  A recipe for utter chaos. 

No judgment about why Israel is doing what it's doing in response to Hamas' horrific, inhuman butchery.  Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic. 

Hamas has a history and reputation for putting women and children first....as targets. I have no doubt they will refuse to allow anyone to leave.

Agree 100%. 

They're telling citizens of Gaza not to give in to Israel's "psychological warfare" and to stay put.  Hamas is fully expecting Israel to launch a large scale ground operation and they just love the optics of their own citizens being caught in crossfire of a heavy-handed Israeli response.  As the de facto governing entity in Gaza, Hamas should be doing everything in its power to move innocent Palestinians out of harm's way.  That's what any sane, compassionate government would do. 

Hamas doesn't give a rat's ass about their own people.  If their citizens can't or won't fight the Israelis directly, they can at least die and make the Zionists look bad in the process.  Hamas sees their population as nothing more than convenient PR cannon fodder.

[Lambykins]

Had a long discussion with a friend about Hamas, the Palestinian populace, etc today.
Hezbollah, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, Egypt, every ME country says "We stand with our Palestinian brothers and sisters!" but will not take in even one Palestinian refugee.
Why not? What's going on here?
It seems that many of these oil rich countries could take in a small percentage of the Palestinians without suffering economically. Yet, they refuse time after time to do that.
Historically, I know the original plan was to have Israel AND an official Palestine as separate autonomous nations but this was stopped by the other middle east countries. Not Israel. The other countries that "stand with their Palestinian brothers and sisters" did not want them to have their own country.
I will never understand the middle east.

[Uomo Senza Nome]

Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic. 

The Gaza is small. No matter where you are you could walk out in less than 3 hours. Of course you would have to leave everything behind.

[Uomo Senza Nome]

Hezbollah, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, Egypt, every ME country says "We stand with our Palestinian brothers and sisters!" but will not take in even one Palestinian refugee.
Why not? What's going on here?
It seems that many of these oil rich countries could take in a small percentage of the Palestinians without suffering economically. Yet, they refuse time after time to do that.

It was done in 1967. There are about 5 million Palestinians living in other Arab nations including about half of them in Jordan. The problems are:

- They never left, many are actually descendants
- They don't become citizens or work, just more mouths to feed
- They do become terrorists and blow things up in the new country

[majorhavoc]

Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic. 

The Gaza is small. No matter where you are you could walk out in less than 3 hours. Of course you would have to leave everything behind.

That assumes that everyone is capable of walking for 3 hours - men, women, children, the elderly, infirm, etc.  And as you say, leaving everything behind, including food, water, shelter, etc, etc. 

I continue to submit that 1.1 million people within 24 hours even reaching the city limits of an incredibly dense urban area, let alone somewhere safe, is utterly impossible. 

[Raptor]

Just pointing out the that the evacuation order is utterly, completely unrealistic. 

The Gaza is small. No matter where you are you could walk out in less than 3 hours. Of course you would have to leave everything behind.

Gaza is only 25 miles long so yes it is small. I am not sure I could walk 25 miles in 3 hour but the evacuation area called for by Israel is not 25 miles away. I was be able to walk 10 miles in 3 hours about a month ago. That said that walk was in the open country side.

On the other hand it has taken me 30 minutes to leave a stadium and get to my car ~1/4 mile away. The difference is that I was making that walk with ~ 30,000 other people. This is closer to the speed over ground that an evacuation can take. Also everyone was in a good mood and happy. There were no pissed off, distraught people, just drunks slowing down the process.

Evacuations from NOLA typically proceed at 5 miles per hour. 60 miles takes 12 to 18 hours.   

[Raptor]

Hezbollah, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Syria, Egypt, every ME country says "We stand with our Palestinian brothers and sisters!" but will not take in even one Palestinian refugee.
Why not? What's going on here?
It seems that many of these oil rich countries could take in a small percentage of the Palestinians without suffering economically. Yet, they refuse time after time to do that.

It was done in 1967. There are about 5 million Palestinians living in other Arab nations including about half of them in Jordan. The problems are:

- They never left, many are actually descendants
- They don't become citizens or work, just more mouths to feed
- They do become terrorists and blow things up in the new country

In addition to the above...

Hamas has a history and reputation for putting women and children first....as targets. 

They reap what they sow.

[Lambykins]

You can click on a couple of links to get to the photograph.
I did not.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/israel-shouldn-t-had-prove-165103707.html

[Raptor]

You can click on a couple of links to get to the photograph.
I did not.
https://www.yahoo.com/news/israel-shouldn-t-had-prove-165103707.html

I did click on it and really do not suggest you do so.

Note you do have to click 3 times. It is NWS and disturbing.

BTW please do not post gory and NWS photos here unless they are posted like this with an explicit warning and the need to click through to the photo.

[Lambykins]

Many were saying "Where is the proof?" of the atrocities.
There it is.
I did not click through to see it. Just reading of the brutalities inflicted by Hamas made me ill.
I have no need to confirm what eyewitnesses already have stated in many, many interviews.